Talk:Fiendish Brute (3.5e Class)

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What, exactly, is wrong with it as-is? Surgo 15:46, 11 October 2008 (MDT)

Well, I did some 'wikification' but as the policy isn't exactly enumerated anywhere it's hard to say if it's right or not. Surgo 10:16, 12 October 2008 (MDT)

Does the "attribute boost" class feature refer to Str, Dex, and Con?


Power - 5/5 I give this class a 5 out of 5 because it is very difficult to kind a fault in one of Frank & K's classes. → Rith (talk) 00:34, 18 April 2009 (MDT)

Wording - 5/5 I give this class a 5 out of 5 because it is very easy to understand. → Rith (talk) 00:34, 18 April 2009 (MDT)

Formatting - 5/5 I give this class a 3 out of 5 because massive portions of the preload are missing, though, interwiki linking is decently comprehensive. (Also, you have one red link in the bonus feats section). → Rith (talk) 00:34, 18 April 2009 (MDT)

This rating should now be changed as stuff was added. Surgo 13:14, 24 May 2009 (MDT)
Just got on, and you're right, this is most definently worth a 5. → Rith (talk) 09:54, 25 May 2009 (MDT)

Flavor - 5/5 I give this class a 5 out of 5 because the brute force of this class makes you agree with its flavor. → Rith (talk) 00:34, 18 April 2009 (MDT)

Poor Bab?[edit]

I was kinda imagining fiendish brute would have some kind of battle prowess. Poor bab make it weird, especially normal outsider get full bab. --Lord Dhazriel 01:38, 6 May 2009 (MDT)

Well, when you crunch the numbers, this class technically could be getting a bonus to attack rolls equal to an average BAB, considering they get those constant bonuses to either strength, constitution, or dexterity. I personally think .5 BAB is fair here. → Rith (talk) 02:02, 6 May 2009 (MDT)
I disagree. This class should be built around the concept of battle prowess, but it's just a fighter with a wizard's BAB that's been given slightly better ability improvements, and a nice, spiffy natural armor bonus. It deserves full BAB on the account that it is a battle-oriented class. Giving this class a wizard's BAB progression is like... well, giving a sorcerer levels in dragon disciple. What are sorcerers gonna do with that increased strength and intelligence, anyway? Also, I'd like to know if the natural armor bestowed by this class stacks with already existing sources of natural armor you might have. --Sulacu 08:24, 7 May 2009 (MDT)
Rith is correct, it was given poor BAB so the numbers line up. Full BAB would push them off the d20. Surgo 10:08, 7 May 2009 (MDT)
Seriously. Not to mention this class can take Fiendish Feats to become Large and then Huge size, with the corresponding ability score adjustments (the real ones from creature progression, not the bonuses from stuff like Enlarge Self). If you want to make a melee workhorse, you can do it. He'll be slow attacking, but he'll hit like the hammer of God. As for the natural armor, I dunno. I think the rule is it doesn't, but I'd allow it in some circumstances...the one that comes to mind is if someone was playing a straight Brute and needed some extra AC to compensate for not wearing armor or having a shield (the class's Natty armor is...good, but they're still easy to hit from not being proficient in armor or shields.) --Genowhirl 10:19, 7 May 2009 (MDT)


I have to hand it to Genowhirl, he made one really nice sample NPC. Probably the model of what a sample NPC should be. Surgo 20:27, 26 May 2009 (MDT)

Thank you very much. Anyway, as I said back on the Den, I've been making fiends for a friend's campaign lately, so I thought I'd take a crack at putting a few of them up as sample NPCs. Henda is going to be a boss encountered by that party when they're about level 5. It's only by coincidence that he has the Lizardfolk be important in the campaign setting's history. When he mentioned that, I remembered your Lizardfolk variant and suggested it.
Belg's going to show up in the game, too. So is a True Fiend 2/Conduit of the Lower Planes 9/Fire Mage 4, with the Pyre Sphere at Expert Access. Who I don't know if I'll put up as the sample NPC for the Conduit. He's, uh, extremely synergized and high level besides.
Henda's been changed slightly from what I gave to the DM. In that, I included stuff like picking up a big piece of rock and throwing it at someone as a ranged touch attack for a chunk of damage, once his HP is far enough down. Also, the DM had the Spines do shuriken damage.
Anyway, I've had this streak of motivation lately. I planted peas, got a part-time job with full-time benefits, wrote some Fiend Feats, made some NPCs...I hope this lasts... --Genowhirl 20:42, 26 May 2009 (MDT)


Power - 4.5/5 I give this class a 4.5 out of 5 because while it is farely balanced, it is a wee-bit strong.

Wording - 5/5 I give this class a 5 out of 5 because it is very well worded and quite easy to understand for the average player.

Formatting - 5/5 I give this class a 5 out of 5 because from what I could tell it is formatted both in accordance with the rules of DanDWiki, and with thought given to how it would look when finished.

Flavor - 5/5 I give this class a 5 out of 5 because the idea behind it is something that simply had to be done. The class has all the wonderful flavor of a human slow roasted in sage and thyme.


Test it 1 weak ago, this class is overpowerd when once "reach lv 10 or more", it tears enemies apart. Other few fiends are just fine, except summoning. Few feats are badass with those guys, like HUGE FEAT, large feat goes with at least 1lv adj, huge is only with enlarge (unless ur druid). Try out this build: tail, large, huge, arms, arms, wings and place it agains anithing of his CR. Futhermore, there are things caled: templates. Compare them and lv adjustmet with this thing. Unplayable, overpowered. 07:11, 21 September 2010 (MDT)

07:12, 21 September 2010 (MDT)Leviathan616
You botched the test. He'd have to be level 12 to have two sets of Extra Arms. Why is your guy pulling it off at level 10? Also, I supposed it's faintly possible that if you burned your normal progression feats, you could take Wings, Large Size, Huge Size, and one Extra Arms by level 10. But since you only bring up six feats, and the Brute only gets five from class levels, it appears you didn't pay much attention to that, and he doesn't have enough feats between the levels of 5 and 10 to get those particular feats. So, you must have ignored the little bits at the tops of the feats which say "Prequisite: Character level X". I already know you ignored it for Extra Arms. That aside, you're going to have to pull out what monsters you threw at the guy. I'm rather sure you didn't throw him against the juvenile Red Dragon. Even the Noble Salamander is sort of tough. I'm also fairly sure you didn't send much at this guy that can force a Will Save. So, your test is invalidated by dint of not actually following the rules. You may want to go try it again before you start suggesting LA as anything actually sane or good. --Genowhirl 11:00, 21 September 2010 (MDT)


Power - <<<1>>>/5 I give this class a <<<1>>> out of 5 because <<<bonus feats with a wider selection than the fighter combined with ability bonuses and good fort and reflex saves make this class very over powered>>> --Bvalin 11:39, 24 December 2010 (MST)

Wording - <<<5>>>/5 I give this class a <<<5>>> out of 5 because <<<wording is great>>> --Bvalin 11:39, 24 December 2010 (MST)

Formatting - <<<Insert Your Rating Here>>>/5 I give this class a <<<Insert Your Rating Here>>> out of 5 because <<<insert why you gave the rating and how to improve it>>> --Bvalin 11:39, 24 December 2010 (MST)

Flavor - <<<5>>>/5 I give this class a <<<5>>> out of 5 because <<<very interesting>>> --Bvalin 11:39, 24 December 2010 (MST)

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