Talk:Inath (3.5e Variant Rule)
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Should this page be labeled / redirected (3.5 Variant Rule)? Is the Deities & Demigods material still applicable to 4e? I would assume that it is not, and needs to be revised (or else they are going to get rid of it, because the gods are 'distant and uninterested in getting involved in the Prime Material world's affairs')... -- xido 04:43, 5 January 2010 (UTC)
4e Deities and Demigods Equivalent?
Does anyone know if Wizards plans to do anything with deific stuff like 3.5's Deities and Demigods? -- xido 13:32, 19 August 2009 (MDT)
- I need Applicable Statistics for all current 3.5 and Wiki Base Classes. This is One statistic that defines the most used or applicable ability stat of the Class (ie, Str for Fighters, Int for Wizards, Wis for Druids, etc. - is often stated under ABILITIES as the first and most important statistic for the class/niche).
- Change all page subtitles to 'Inath Supplement' including Energy Paths, Quests, Inath-specific rolls/skills, etc.
- Describe Inath - more?
- Describe Qabala
- Describe Wraeththu and links
- Describe Divine Spark
- Describe Energy Paths (tables are done)
- Add Knowledge (Inath - Energy Paths), Inath Crafts, Planar Travel, etc.
- Add information for all Inath Quests (what appropriate rank/caste/level, prerequisites, nature, outcomes, etc.)
- Describe Affinities
- Describe Talents - new ideas/submissions
- Describe Cults and Cabals
- Describe the culture and history of Inath
- Describe Anakim and the Tiamat Chronicles (links from Elftown)
- Describe Jashnia and the Epicene (links from Elftown)
I need to come up with a holistic approach for all Deific traits and how they can be managed. I know that all things will include an Ego and/or Spirit rolls, as according to the rules of those supplemental rolls - but I think for now I simply need a full compilation of all deity traits that state something to the effect of, "any deity of any Divine Rank lower than n cannot overcome this effect". To fix this extremely inflexible rule, I have developed a set of alternative rolls that would allow another deific character/creature to oppose, manipulate, dispel, or otherwise change the final effect of such a Deific Effect. Anything currently in Divine Traits that is specifically suited to Divine Rank as an unyielding statement of divine power would need to be changed to this.
Any Inath effect that happens between two deities is composed of the following process:
- Knowledge (Inath - Void, Veil, Umbra, and/or Permea)
- Craft (any Inath Craft skill necessary for the final effect)
- Either an Ego or Spirit roll, with potential opposing rolls, re-rolls, or other potential actions. This specific set of rolls is similar in nature to a divine form of a grapple check which is entirely spiritual and/or mental in nature. While Ego represents a creature's active, willing force of mind - Spirit represents the spiritual power inherent in a soul or deity outside of the scope of their own intentions or personal force, but more to do with the forcefulness or resolution of their soul-power. Any Ego or Spirit rolls and their direct effects/outcomes would be considered Deific in nature. Only deities or those creatures with access to their Ego & Spirit rolls, Inath Points, and applicable skills necessary to successfully execute the actions (Craft, Knowledge - Inath, Telekinesis, etc.)
- Other applicable rolls might also be possible to be applicable (such as Survival/Track, attack rolls, saving throws, etc.) depending upon the actions being taken, although their direct effects would not be specifically Deific effects - unless directly related to and in tandem with an Ego, Spirit, Inath Craft checks, Telekinesis checks, Inath Point usage, etc.
Most any time these rolls, checks, and actions would be taken would be between two deities vying for control (divine dominance), or when attempting to exert their divine force over reality in a manner to spell use, manifesting, and other similar effects but directly related to Deific forces - the spiritual, mental, and rank-oriented forces behind deities of any form or background.
Spells, manifestations, soulmelds, invocations, and other similar effects including Supernatural (Su) and Spell-like Abilities (Sp) are subject to these deific effects as if dominated (when a deific creature establishes divine dominance over a location/situation/creature/deity/etc.). This would not include Extraordinary effects, since they are natural products of a simple non-magical process. Only a deity with the ability to directly affect reality in such a way that would be an obvious showy use of their deific powers would affect an Extraordinary ability - often through the use of a Talent, Salient Divine Ability, etc.
Compilation and Considerations
I want to say thank you, GD, for helping me out with the formatting on this page and the table. This is my baby project, something I have been working on for quite a few years now, and I am just now getting it ready for 3.5 when 4th is coming out next year *sigh*...
I appreciate the help, and I hope that you can stick around to see what all happens here. You never know - you may like it for your Outsiders and Divine creatures. ;) --xido 09:44, 18 September 2007 (MDT)
- Glad to be a help, and I will continue to help when I can! --Green Dragon 22:36, 18 September 2007 (MDT)
Er... the intro seems a little rude... I don't think people would ever think this is bad without looking it over, and I feel that a rude introduction puts people on edge... I feel this should be changed for the better... Your thoughts? --Green Dragon 22:35, 18 September 2007 (MDT)
- Ranting will be placed below, on this page -->
- You're right. It was rude. But that's how you have to be sometimes when everyone thinks you're a noob because you're not familiar with wiki tags and formatting etiquette.
- That's just me. Anyone who knows me and sees this will know exactly why I post those kinds of words. Because there's always that one guy that walks in and says, "This idea is too much like Qabala!" "It's not balanced!" "You edited rules/progressions!" "Wraeththu are hermaphrodites and that's gross! Why did you put this here?", and my favorite, "This is so lame! You didn't even create your own idea! You just copied their's!"
- Forgive my bad attitude on the subject. I have had some problems getting people's honest opinions of the material without all the excess opionations of other sorts. It's super fun (note the sarcasm here).
- I appreciate you looking this over. I need some testers, once the information has been posted in full. No, it isn't even close. -- xido 10:59, 19 September 2007 (MDT)
- Er... I don't think people consider other people "noobs" on D&D Wiki because they are not familiar with something... Anyway, I hope no one D&D Wiki gives you bad remarks over this, and I am glad you removed the rude intro (thanks!). --Green Dragon 18:34, 23 September 2007 (MDT)
- No problem at all.
- Well, I did have some questionable conversations the last time I tried posting things on Wizards actual website, and I was basically harrassed for not knowing my D&D stats on some minor issue that only a person with a complete understanding of backstory and the entire line of publications from Wizards would know. So I am a little reticent about that in general.
- So far no one has said anything like that, but I also haven't made a point of asking for too many people's opinions unless it's obvious that they truly want to help. (Like you. I appreciate that.)
- Then again, it seems like D&D Wiki is still relatively new, so I don't think there's too many people trying to be the big guys around here yet. That was most definitely not the case in Wizards' forums. I once got harrassed for bringin up the fact that I found similarities between Elan from Psionics and Wraeththu by Storm Constantine. I was then mercilessly attacked for my interest in alternative fantasy literture and my complete misunderstanding of the fact that the Elan had been around since 2nd edition. It was not a pretty site.
- So far, I like it here, and the info we have posted up is very professional looking and cool. I am proud to have my info here with you guys. Maybe some day someone will use it in their games. That would be fun. -- xido 10:05, 25 September 2007 (MDT)
- I am glad you like D&D Wiki. Also, I agree with you on the Wizards thing. One of the reasons I no longer go on Wizards anymore is because of some of the people. whew... Again, I am glad you like it here :). --Green Dragon 22:51, 3 October 2007 (MDT)
You may think this is a rip-off. You may think this is lame. You may think that I am wasting my time here. You may think I have not put very much thought into this idea. You may think that this is not my project. You may think I am an asshole just for saying these things out loud. Great. Awesome. Wonderful.
I DO NOT CARE WHAT YOU THINK OF THIS CONCEPT. It doesn't matter. You don't know how fun it is yet. If you want to help here, you can begin by not trying to explain to me how unbalanced this idea is in terms of the d20 system. You are wrong, and you will be proven wrong in time. Get over it. This system is ALTERNATIVE, FUN, and INTERESTING.
That being said, sit down and have a cup of tea. Many things to do here. --xido 15:34, 7 September 2007 (MDT)
- Thanks for moving this here! --Green Dragon 18:37, 23 September 2007 (MDT)
Table is finished
And therefore, I need a couple people to check this all out, and see if it looks cool, and sticks with the Divine Ranks info... Yes, I know. I left out Travel. This is because I have a better version which is still to be posted with the Divine Spark info. Thanks, all! -- xido 18:23, 22 September 2007 (MDT)
- One thing that could be changed would be to change all the red links so they have an identifier. For example Energy Path really should link to Energy Path (Inath Supplement) so people know what it is part of. --Green Dragon 18:36, 23 September 2007 (MDT)
- That sounds fine. I was actually wondering about that part. I mean, I know we've laid this info out in a "class table", but let's be frank: this isn't really a class by the technical standards. So I was wondering: what do we consider this? "Alternative System" "Homebrew Campaign System" "Divine Rank Class Progression"... ??? Because referring to another page as an "Inath Supplement" works great to reference this page and system, but, well, what IS this system? I mean, I made it because I wanted powerful opponents, Divine potential, and a flair in my homebrew tabletop/online campaign world that set a real mood for things in Jashnia. But that doesn't really make it a class, and I don't really know where it fits in in the bigger scheme of things.
- So, my question to you then is Where does this fit in with things already posted and included? What should the descriptor for "Inath" actually be? I don't really feel comfortable with calling it a "Class". It's definitely not that. Second, I want to post some information about Jashnia, as well as Kalamar (3.0 Living Kingdoms) and a new homebrew world I am putting together. What descriptor do those use? I have seen "Campaign Setting" "Wikiworld" and a few others so far. But to remain solid, what should I be dubbing these places? Jashnia began as a combined effort on Elftown, and has progressed into the host world for my Inath campaign this last time around. -- xido 10:32, 24 September 2007 (MDT)
- I was thinking that maybe this could be a variant rule system and use the "(DnD Variant Rule)" identifier. Your thoughts? Also, if the other things you are thinking of brining onto this site are CS's (Campaign Settings) than please use the "(DnD Campaign Setting)" descriptor. I hope this helps. --Green Dragon 10:24, 26 September 2007 (MDT)
- Sounds great. Be forewarned that the info here will be moved sometime shortly, to reflect that claim. Are there any other (DnD Variant Rule) systems already posted that I can look over for inspiration on how to lay this out?
- I also finished the Quests portion last night, which now makes everything except Travel from the Divine Abilities SRD content posted to these pages. I am so excited. This is more progress than I have ever made in a single month on this project.
- Any input as far as what you think of the layout of the system? Does it seem applicable enough without creating TOO much powerplay? I will detail the Ego and Spirit Rolls soon enough, which will bring a lot of things into focus. My players liked that part the most. I think they just liked having bonuses that equaled 20+... ;) -- xido 10:37, 26 September 2007 (MDT)
- Sorry, there is currently no standard for how variant rules should look. If you want a good look for this variant rule I would recommend looking through the current variant rules and finding a look that would fit this variant rule... Also I think this layout will start looking better and better as more information is filled out and you learn wiki-syntax better and better :). --Green Dragon 22:54, 3 October 2007 (MDT)
- I definitely agree with that. I am delighted that I even have pages like this now. This idea has been in the works since before 2003, technically. I am so pumped to have it posted and working out details. Can we have a crew of people who have worked on other Divine-related pages come and help out with making new Inath Talents, since this is the least detailed portion that I have so far...? That would be awesome...
- Also, on Wizards' site, there is a World Creation Project which went mostly unused and faltering... Is this like the better version of that, and to people know that this wiki is exactly what they were hoping for in that forum? -- xido 11:53, 4 October 2007 (MDT)
- I highly doubt that most the people on wizards know about D&D Wiki, but you are right. D&D Wiki would be the perfect place to have a community driven CS. --Green Dragon 13:04, 13 October 2007 (MDT)