Talk:Alchemist (3.5e Class)
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2/18/2008 - Got annoyed that no one actually put any effort into this class after the first day, so I fixed it. Skill list, skills per level, feats, and over all progression has been fixed. Now if only we can make a new system for how many concoctions one can make in a day. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 126.96.36.199 (talk • contribs) 01:08, 19 February, 2008 (UTC). Please sign your posts!
 Needs Artificer Prestige option
Alchemy fits the mechanistic nature of Artificers far better than wizards and Sorcerers do. There should be an Alchemist Artificer Prestige class (Subtract wand making and substitute Boom-tube gun manufacture (They can make Gunpowder, why not a primitive gun with potion-delivering projectiles?)
 Slightly overpowered
The ability to create arcane spells through potions is fair, but as it stands, they can play a fairly decent arcane caster, while maintaining a complete repertoire of alchemist class powers. The overpoweredness is actually greatest at first level, where they can easily prepare a couple of level 1 arcane spells and still have a vast array of other effects under their belt. Add to this the fact that a couple of days downtime grants them near omnipotence, having 20-odd potions ready to use. Perhaps reducing the number of spell effects that they can recreate by one per day would be enough.
 Marked for Deletion?! :O
I can't allow this to be deleted! I promised a friend of mine that I would make this class. If no one is willing to finish what this person started, I will gladly take over the task. The only help I will need is in putting it into a proper template; I don't know what's required for a base class, having made only a single prestige class so far. Plus, it will probably need grammar and spelling revisions - I type fast, and sometimes don't go back to check my work. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Cerin616 (talk • contribs) 03:47, 9 January, 2008 (UTC). Please sign your posts!
- If you're willing to fill in the basic details of the class, like features gained at each level, saves, BAB, and spells (if applicable), I'm sure people here (myself included) are willing to help format and edit your class. Don't wait too long, though. -- Cronocke 22:55, 8 January 2008 (MST)
- You have my hand. I'd edit it now but I don't know which direction you're going with it. Off hand seems like a poor BAB class with high crafting abilities, poor Fort and Reflex, good Will, skills everywhere, and something rather kickass to make up for the rather commoner-riffic basic stats. -- Eiji 23:03, 8 January 2008 (MST)
 Apologies to Sakurasboy for taking the page over, and more issues
Another tough part is coming up with a system of making potions etc... I dont want it quite as limited as spells, but the whole powerpoint thing is weak too... If you guys have any suggestions, im willing to listen Plus im going in a kind of direction where by himself the alchemist is finished in a battle, but he is more of a buffer class with his potion making skills. He can make some protective things, but not enough to be a power class. ill get back to editing it soon. -- Cerin616 5:53, 9 January 2008 (EST)
- I am finished editing for now, i may come back on in a little, but most of the important info is there. -- Cerin616 7:58, 9 January 2008 (EST)
- Interesting. I have some difficultly understanding it all but that is probably because the powers/quasi-spells are unfinished. One thing I DID see that interested me greatly, though, was the idea of turning steel to the properties of mythril. I like that, a lot, and promote the idea of an alchemist being able to alter your weapon properties, either on the fly (something like Silversheen but for adamantium, mithril, darkwood, fruitcake, etc), and more permanent crafts which can use the current systems contained in the Craft skill and anything else appropriate (perhaps Craft Magic Arms & Armor, in spite of it not being a spellcasting class, to where they have access to the feat to perform certain scientific enchantments of typically magical abilities? I dunno.
- Anyway, I'll at least try to think of a nifty capstone for you. For the way of doing things, maybe X/potions can be created a day would work, and refresh when you sleep? Almost spellcasting, but I'm thinking more sorcerer than wizard, doing it on the fly. -- Eiji 18:40, 9 January 2008 (MST)
- What you said about the magic in weapons, that was one part i didnt elaborate on yet. In alchemical alteration lvl 9 the alchemist gains the ability to meld amulets, rings, etc into the actual weapon itself (im thinking of a limit of how many magical items he can blend in). The weapon would then gain the properties of the magic item.
- I was also going to put in the epic alchemist facts that at lvl 25 the alchemist can turn steel into mithral entirely, giving it every component of the metal, and at level 30 mithral to adamantium. Also what you said about the silversheen, that is almost exactly what "plateing" is doing. Its like having a silver plated steel sword, only silversheen is only limited to silver, while plateing can plate it with any metal (i.e. adamantium or mithral to make it slightly stronger, silver to affect lycanthrops, etc.) I like your idea of the x/potions a day though, ill try and elaborate off of that. Im hitting the bed now, so i will work more tomarrow -- Cerin616 22:22, 9 January 2008 (EST)
- Please indent your comments (use this : symbol) and try not to turn topic titles into paragraphs. As for your plating idea, it seems interesting, although mithral, you should note, would not make a weapon stronger. The only thing it does is make a weapon lighter in weight (but not in category), and a plating of mithral would be too minor to have a noteworthy effect. -- Cronocke 06:26, 10 January 2008 (MST)
- plated with mithral, a steel weapon would increase form a hardness of 10 to 13, but the weight difference would have no effect, seeing as your adding metal..., so thats a good point, unless that +3 to DC was really that important...
- And sorry about the topic title thing, i just wanted it in there, lol. Cerin616 12:17, 10 January 2008 (EST)
- It's ok that you took it over. I was having a hard time coming up with ideas for it. All in all though. I think from now on I might stick to making races. I'll throw a race together for the alchemist class now. Probably a gnome variation or something. Anyways I'm kinda glad you took over. I was also having a hard time finding time to do it. At least I helped in a small way to save the alchemist idea from deletion. Thanks man. Sakurasboy 1:14, 05 February 2008
Formatting - 4/5: I give this a 4/5 on formatting because it has no links, does not use Template:Quote with the first quote, and uses x instead of × (×). --Green Dragon 13:46, 21 February 2008 (MST)
- Editing this up to add in some links and such --Cerin616, Drew 22:10, 6 October 2008 (MDT)
- I have removed my rating and I hope to see this class continue to improve! --Green Dragon 10:39, 7 October 2008 (MDT)
I strongly oppose the deletion of the Alchemist this class is perfectly playable. All because it isn't a combat class doesn't mean it should be deleted. Also this class is actually being used in one of my campains and works out perfectly sure he's not on the front lines but he is a very useful tactical member of their squad. If worse comes to worse i will adopt the class, even though it is playable and operational as is. --D.M.DemonicPanda 20:48 April 2, 2009 (EST)
- Feel free to adopt the class. I agree, just because a cast isn't that good at combat doesn't mean that they can't be useful. --Sabre070 18:59, 2 April 2009 (MDT)
- Did you read the candidate for deletion message? I didn't propose it because it's not a combat class. I proposed it because there's not enough damn information in the page for someone who doesn't know what's going on to use it. Surgo 20:37, 2 April 2009 (MDT)
- Sorry... But what do you think now better? --D.M.DemonicPanda 07:43, 3 April 2009 (EST)
 Class Edits
I'm adding the Brew Alchemical Potion (DnD Feat) to this class as by popular demand however it is currently only in its preliminary stages. This acts to immitate some of the spells people have grown to love. Plz don't smite me!!! --D.M.DemonicPanda 20:04, 3 April 2009 (EST)
- Alchemical Potions: This ability grants the Alchemist the Brew Alchemical Potion feat that immitates spells of other classes. However brewing these potions use Alchemy points and ingredients that are consumed in making the potions.
- Added Oxidation Transmutation to make this class more useful in combat. --D.M.DemonicPanda 23:24, 8 April 2009
- Added the Ability to create Melt Powder and Razor Ice Powder from Frostburn as well as Chalk. --D.M.DemonicPanda 18:55, 9 April 2009
- Added the the ability to create Liquid Night, Brittlebone, Embalming Fire and Ghost Oil from Libris Morris. --D.M.DemonicPanda 19:15, 9 April 2009
- Added the ability to create Blood Thickener and the Portable Pyre form Dragon Magazine 324. DemonicPanda 17:14, 22 April 2009
- Added the ability to create a Minor Elixer of Life to help you outlive your allys and win all the loot. Demonic Panda 22:22, 19 May 2009
- Added the Deoxidation Transmutation to balance out the Oxidation transmutation in the spirit of the true alchemist in that all must be in balance. Also if you've read the book don't go see Angels and Demons. Demonic Panda 20:01, 24 May 2009
- Added the Gold to Lead Transmutation counteracting the acts of the Lead to Gold transmutation. Demonic Panda
- Added the Ability to create Insect Repellent. Demonic Panda
- Added the ability to create Ironbane Acid, Stonebreaker Acid, and Woodripper Acid from Dragon Magazine 359.
- Added the ability Rubedo that can fuse spirits to objects to make the animate and Fermentation. Demonic Panda
 Infinite Wealth
- Discussion moved from User talk:Mister Sinister#Alchemist
My Alchemist class may be able to create infinite wealth however this process would take an extremly long time can only have alchemy points equal to his alchemist level(Minimum 10) + modifier (On average +3/4) + Craft(Alchemy) rank (usually max around 40). Each 5lb conversion costing two of these points. Thus creating a fairly balanced ability however I understand your concern. --D.M.DemonicPanda 16:46, 7 April 2009 (MDT)
- Balanced Now? (Only Refering to the monitary aspect) --D.M.DemonicPanda 18:46, 9 April 2009
 I think this is an excellent Foundation
I will be honest here I am new to editing wiki sites so I am trying not to mess anything up. However can we not site the information if we are drawing it from a certain text.
Also the Secret of alchemy is great I love that but what are the controlling factors for Nigredo, not sure who added those but I am having trouble finding reference material on the power as it is listed here. --Siamko 07:19, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
 Alchemist goals
The Alchemist actually has three goals
1.) They believed that some elements could be changed into others. They attempted to change base metals (lead, tin) into valuable ones like gold.
2.) They believed they could find a substance that would give them eternal life
3.) They beleieved they could produce a universal solvent that would desolve all substances (wich really would never work, what the heck would you store it in?)
You only cover two of the three goals of the alchemists in this class. I am just pointing this out in case you didn't already realize your missing something. :)--Vrail 00:25, 3 May 2010 (UTC)
 More Information needed for Rubedo
It says that the subject retains all abilities they had previously, but that doesn't seem appropriate. For example, if applied to a suit of armor, it would make sense that they wouldn't breathe, and they would be subject to rusting. If applied to a wooden Mannequin they would be vulnerable to rotting if wet, and fire if dry. It's also not established if/how the cure spells would work for subjects whose bodies are made of strange materials since it's not quite clear if they're a living creature. Does the subject of a Rubedo become a Construct? Am I to understand that you can use Rubedo to bind loose spirits whether they're willing or not? It doesn't mention anything about what abilities the subject retains if their new body is not the same shape as their old one. It also doesn't mention how to handle size changes. i.e. if, hypothetically, outsiders had spirits, if a Titan were brought back in a human sized suit of armor, would their Oversized weapon ability still allow them to use a gargantuan warhammer, or just a warhammer one size category above their current one?Ziv 12:49, 2 July 2010 (UTC)
 not sure what your trying to do but i may have some ideas for you
well first off the whole alchemist thing has been thought of. second if you are going for full metal alchemist then you may want to try watching the shows or reading the manga or looking it up on Google. now that i got that out of the way. ALCHEMISTS DON'T JUST TURN THINGS INTO GOLD!!! alchemists believe in the law of equivalent exchange. meaning to gain something, something of equal value must be lost. this of course is assuming that you use the normal transmutation method. if you happen to make/find a philosophers stone on the other hand you can make things out of thin air without having to waste a lot of energy. im not sure how alchemy came into being but basicly they can make anything from anything. they can change molicules in the air to make them more flamable they can also take the metal out of the ground and transmute it into gold for thier journey. basic alchemy is a 3 step phase 1st is the recognition of the material that you are transmuting 2nd is the act of breaking down that element into its base molicules and 3rd is the reconstruction of those elements into something new... again if this isnt what you are trying to do then sorry i saw alchemist and i saw transmute. but anyways. to transmute you have to have the correct circle for the transmutation. you also have to have the required energy to do it. most alchemists are part of the military but there are some that are scientists or renegades so they can basicly be of any race, gender, or alighnmen and they also can serve almost any god. all you have to do is find out how to do the transmutations and not make them overpowered and you can make a really good class
- I'm not even the author, but I think you watch too much anime. Real alchemy is not based on Full-metal alchemist; It's vice versa, and hardly, even, since Full-metal alchemist adds all kinds of fantasy elements to it. Pro-tip: Alchemy is pretty much chemistry, although people used to think you could do all of the crazy things like turning lead into gold with it. For being a potion making and spell class, it's fitting. Jwguy 10:33, 23 July 2011 (MDT)
Power - 3/5 I give this class a 3 out of 5 because the Alchemist described here is played like a support role; at least when compared to the average kick-in-the-door barbarian. The Alchemist can be a great asset to your team improving everyone's armor and weapon rolls, as well as contribute to crazy roleplay feats that other classes would have deemed impossible (They turned that evil Mind Flayer into a good guy!) The in battle power tends to seem a little lacking, especially when the alchemist is at her lower levels: Their battle prowess with martial weapons would be comparable to a wizard or sorcerer. Later on in the campaign when the character has leveled a significant amount the alchemist is able to contribute a bit more. For example there is a spell at level 20 that, if chosen, will pretty much reduce ANY thing into a pile of black ash. The power doesn't need to be adjusted however because the alchemist has no need for a zanbato. They would prefer to keep to themselves and keep studying their books. --188.8.131.52 23:12, 15 February 2013 (MST)
Wording - 4/5 I give this class a 4 out of 5 because this class if easy to use and understand minus the fact that Alchemist points may be a hard concept for people running off of super basic "Roll the D20 and roleplay" methods. --184.108.40.206 23:12, 15 February 2013 (MST)
Formatting - 5/5 I give this class a 5 out of 5 because any DM or player could easily integrate this class into their game right now. The format doesn't need any changing besides the personal preference of the DM --220.127.116.11 23:12, 15 February 2013 (MST)
Flavor - 4/5 I give this class a 4 out of 5 because the character is down to earth and a breath of fresh air when compared to some of the more garish and outlandish classes and races you see. I am insisting that all of my PCs at least give this class a look. I would like to see some sort of greater transformation at level 20 or mayhaps more development into epic level characters. Also there was a bit of a disappointment when I couldn't find any actual info about the Philosophers Stone, even though it was mentioned. I suppose that just leaves room for the DM to be creative though. This class is my current favorite and I will be applying this to my next campaign that is about to start --18.104.22.168 23:12, 15 February 2013 (MST)