https://www.dandwiki.com/w/api.php?action=feedcontributions&user=Moon+Sugar+Vehk&feedformat=atomD&D Wiki - User contributions [en]2024-03-28T17:16:04ZUser contributionsMediaWiki 1.35.8https://www.dandwiki.com/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Ehsteve&diff=289952User talk:Ehsteve2008-10-31T18:50:23Z<p>Moon Sugar Vehk: New section: Tamriel settings</p>
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== Tamriel settings ==<br />
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I love the TES games... which you can kinda tell by my name so id be more than happy to contribute or help with what you guys need.. that and... i posted information on argonians and a few other races in another tes related setting.... so if you could transfer that information to yours.. or merge the two settings it'd be great... i don't know how to merge.... so what ever help you needs just message me..<br />
--[[User:Moon Sugar Vehk|Moon Sugar Vehk]] 12:50, 31 October 2008 (MDT)--[[User:Moon Sugar Vehk|Moon Sugar Vehk]] 12:50, 31 October 2008 (MDT)</div>Moon Sugar Vehkhttps://www.dandwiki.com/w/index.php?title=Talk:Main_Page&diff=289055Talk:Main Page2008-10-27T16:06:32Z<p>Moon Sugar Vehk: New section: Tamriel and Elder scrolls: oblivion</p>
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<div>{{Archives<br />
|label1=Discussions 1&ndash;30<br />
|label2=Discussions 31&ndash;44<br />
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== 4th edition ==<br />
<br />
I don't really want to recreate the rumours and excitement concerning the upcoming 4th edition, but it looks like we need to think about a way to handle it here. It's pretty sure that there will be two editions in parallel use, at least for a while, so we need a way to separate editions. Tagging articles [[:Category:3.5]] and [[:Category:4.0]] wouldn't be too hard, what I'm concerned about is article lemmata for articles that exists in different versions for different editions. <br />
<br />
Also, it's not clear yet whether there will be a 4th edition SRD. I hope there will be one. --[[User:Mkill|Mkill]] 08:50, 16 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Might be a good idea to put SRD 3.5 articles with a template underneath (this is only a suggestion, not an attempt to have a million templates per page):<br />
<br />
:{| style="text-align: center; font-size:0.9em;" width="100%"<br />
| [[Image:D20 logo 4.jpg|40px]]<br/>This material is published under the [[V3.5 rules]].<br/><small>[[Main Page|&rarr;More]]</small><br />
|}<br />
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:Although, there might be too many templates if we do this. perhaps we could replace the SRD template to this for 3.5 articles:<br />
<br />
:{| class="messagebox protected" style="border:2px solid #99B; padding:0px; font-size:0.9em;"<br />
|-<br />
| valign="top" | [[Image:D20 logo 4.jpg|45px]]<br />
| This material is published under the '''[[Open Game License v1.0a]]'''. The [[GNU Free Documentation License]] does not apply to this page. This material is for the D&D [[V 3.5 rules]].<br />
|}<br />
<br />
:We don't really need to mark homebrew stuff- it should work for 4.0 rules anyway. Whatre can I find news on the 4th edition, anyway? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 09:10, 16 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Have you been at the WotC Homepage lately? Did you notice something? --[[User:Mkill|Mkill]] 09:48, 16 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
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:::If 4e is really coming out we can most likely just slap on a small template on all 4e things or all 3.5e things. Also, the categories you said above will work. I do not see it as too much of a problem... --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:55, 16 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::According to my reasearch, it ios not out until 2011 (rather silly really; why advertise it four and a bit years before its release), so we really do not have to bother with it yet, anyway. {{Unsigned|Sam Kay|10:04, 16 August 2007 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
::::::Boo! Hsssss! I had a browser tab open for the last ten minutes of the countdown of the [http://www.wizards.com/dnd D&D] page. Once it finished, I got "Service Unavailable". About as disappointing as 3.0 psionics. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 16:35, 16 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::Lol ''':)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:38, 16 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
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::::::::4th edition is definitely coming. We really need to sit down, argue, butt heads, and work out the namespacing issues now. Thankfully, 3E has a namespace already. We have lots to sort out. Wikiworld will instantly be 4th compatible, as I haven't bothered with stats for most of the writeup. The new MIC style items should also be compatible. There are interesting times ahead. --[[User:Dmilewski|Dmilewski]] 18:39, 16 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
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:::::::::It has been stated that the PHB will be out May '08 MM June '08 and DMG July '08 {{Unsigned|Quill|19:11, 16 August 2007 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
::::::::::Yes, we have a year to prepare but it makes it easier later if we start thinking about it now. Btw., I'm still waiting for the WotC Homepage to survive sudden massive attention so I can see the official WotC Press release... --[[User:Mkill|Mkill]] 03:22, 17 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
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:::::::::::Just do what I suggested and replace the OGC tgemplate with:<br />
:::::::::::{| class="messagebox protected" style="border:2px solid #99B; padding:0px; font-size:0.9em;"<br />
|-<br />
| valign="top" | [[Image:D20 logo 4.jpg|45px]]<br />
| This material is published under the '''[[Open Game License v1.0a]]'''. The [[GNU Free Documentation License]] does not apply to this page. This material is for the D&D [[V 3.5 rules]].<br />
|}<br />
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:::::::::::It is alot easier to mark 3.5 in this way. You could also add an image to the template to mark it, I suppose. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 04:30, 17 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
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::::::::::::I vote to leave the V3.5 on the wiki pemanently (unless the wiki runs out of memory), as some people will still use V3.5. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 09:39, 17 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::::Btw, [http://rustmonster.net/2007/08/16/dd-4th-edition-announced-gen-con/ here] it says that Wizards announced to continue the OGL. Good decision. --[[User:Mkill|Mkill]] 09:45, 17 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
{{Discussion Indentation Revert}}<br />
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:Can we get a 4E Info/Rumor link up on the landing page? (Though we may as well link it to ENWorld. They will have the best coverage.) [http://www.enworld.org/index.php?page=4e ENWorld 4E Page] It hasn't been updated yet, but it will be. --[[User:Dmilewski|Dmilewski]] 14:19, 17 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
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::Great! it will be nice to have 4.0e on the wiki.--[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 08:27, 18 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
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:::A few things. First off we need to figure out if the homebrew material will be compatible with 4e, if it is we are well off. If it is not we need to figure out how we are going to categorize the 3.5e and the 4e homebrew information separately. Oh, and yes, D&D Wiki has enough space to keep the 3.5e material - nothing need ever be deleted to save space on D&D Wiki. Secondly, if we want a link to 4e information from ENWorld then, I feel, that we should add it as a news item. Dmilewski can take care of this if this is the communities decision. Thirdly we need to figure out when the 4e SRD is coming out to see how much time we have to prepare for it. About the SRD (3.5e and 4e); we need to decide if we want a different namespace for the two SRD editions or if we want to organize them by their identifiers. Anyway, if the homebrew information is compatible we are looking at not too much work (and a much more useful and successful D&D Wiki). Let us hope... ''':)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 12:10, 18 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::I think ther homebrew stuff will mostlky ber compatable with 4e, but if not we will have to work to update the best stuff... --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 12:22, 18 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::Either the homebrew material is almost 100% good-to-go or it is not. We cannot have a medium on D&D Wiki. The reason we can not have a medium is because many many people will not switch over to 4e for a long time (or ever!) and we do want want these people to lose D&D Wiki as a recourse. If the two editions are not compatible we will have to have two separate pages like [[Dungeons and Dragons]] and we will have to have 3.5e classes, races, etc and 4e classes, races, etc. Again, we need to really know if they will be compatible or not (and if someone has any information please cite the source). --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 12:32, 18 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::Yeah, I know, I was meaning as they are now... I have had a look at the articles on WotC website, and I seem to remember that the playtest report mentioned that a player was playing a psyon (because it was 3.5e) to see if it was compatible.--[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 12:42, 18 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::I volenteer to help updating homberew stuff to 4e should the need arise (hopefully it won't). --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 12:54, 18 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::::I think that conversion of each section should be considered on a case-by-case basis. For example, magic items may only need a level assigned to them. That's an easy conversion worth doing. Classes and prestige classes will need to be entirely rewritten as trees, maneuvers, or such, if they are worth translating at all. <br />
<br />
::::::::My current belief is that we will need to split the content. That hoses the entire redirect initiative. (That was a reservation of mine with the redirect initiative. All the pages that I did for the SRD were hard-referenced. I used no redirects.) <br />
<br />
::::::::Campaign environments will be easiest to convert. Many simply implement the existing system, then list some house rules. For example, LotR and Wikiworld are both concept heavy, rules light. Wikiworld has always been rules light, as I wanted Wikiworld to work with any game system. I suggest that Sam keep LotR rules light, so as to keep it universal.<br />
<br />
:::::::::I was at GenCon when they made the announcement of 4e. According to Wizards of the Coast, the 3.5e material will be compatible with a minimum of modification. There were no details given at the time, however, so what that means, I'm not sure. --[[User:Skwyd|Skwyd]] 14:04, 23 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::::::Many classes and (both base and prestige) might be obsolete under the new rules- if the same effect can be made just by using talents on one of the other classes. I think we'll have to make a big review of everything and check it for 4e compatibility, maybe putting a 4e Compatible template and a 4e Incompatible template (and nothing on pages that haven't nbeen checked yet, obviously). [[User:MorkaisChosen|MorkaisChosen]] 08:25, 3 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::Or we could just keep 3.5e material 3.5e material, since not everyone is going to switch right away... Maybe keep it for a couple years than change it to 4e. Thoughts? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:16, 4 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
I read on the Wizards page that one thing they're thinking of implementing with all the online stuff they're using in 4th ed is a wiki to allow home brew stuff. If that's true, it may be best to just keep this site in 3.x to avoid competition with the "official" wiki. I'm still uncertain about all that though. Any thoughts? --[[User:Banyan|Banyan]] 23:07, 23 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:I don't think a little competition will hurt. If Wizards opens their own wiki, that's an excellent idea, but it doesn't mean we should give up this project here. --[[User:Mkill|Mkill]] 00:57, 24 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::I wouldn't bother with the "official wiki" anyway. This one is better. Anyway, why would we be scared of competition? It is not like we are trying to make money, or anything. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 04:00, 24 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Would someone like to contact them and ask them if this is true? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 12:35, 26 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
==New Edition Issues==<br />
<br />
The following questions are both technical and procedural. There is no correct answer. These questions are here to collect upcoming issues with the wiki and decisions that should be considered. Please add to the list.<br />
<br />
===General architecture===<br />
<br />
How best to manage a wiki filled with multiple editions and systems (3E, 4E, Modern, Etc.)<br />
<br />
:I am very open to discussion, but I feel that the best way to manage different systems is to make the different edition pages very obvious. For example, we could have all namespace v4 pages come with a slightly darker page background, or something similar. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 10:22, 22 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::I agree. The Wizards message boards use a different skin for each game. &ndash;[[User:Cuthalion|Cúthalion]] <small>([[User talk:Cuthalion|talk]])</small> 10:57, 22 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::I am against the changing of the skin, however I think namespaces are the way to go. We could label the namespaces as SRD3.5e, SRD4e, 4e, 3.5e, D20M, etc. What do you guys think about this idea? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 21:11, 22 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::People will be far too confused if they want to know whether the article is 3.5 or 4.0, and they constantly have to be checking namespaces. It will be much easier if the page background is slightly darker for 4.0, or something similar. I am not talking about a different feel, just a difference. There is a difference :) &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 18:00, 23 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::Why not have two menu pages, one for each edition, and label all pages with 3.5 and 4.0? --[[User: Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 04:02, 24 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::Sam Kay, do you mean namespaces? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:04, 26 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::Yeah... I did. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 06:23, 1 September 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
===Namespaces===<br />
Should we move current SRD pages to a 3E namespace?<br />
<br />
:I assume you mean 3.5E namespace, and I feel that we need to wait a bit until the structure is clear and known to all, but I feel that it definitely needs to happen before 4E comes out. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 10:23, 22 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
How do we want the namespaces to interact?<br />
<br />
:Why not have two D&D menus: 3.5, and 4.0. That way, you would know whether you where in 3.5 or 4.0. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 10:33, 3 September 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
What should we do with articles that are invariant between 3E and 4E (assuming there are any)?<br />
<br />
:This brings up another question: It would be great if there was a way to allow edits on a 3.5E to be reflected, or maybe a reflection would be requested, onto a 4E page. This way the races or whatnot would remain the same. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 10:25, 22 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::I've been wrestling with related questions on [[WikiRPS]]. It's easy to have small (or even large) pieces of shared text, using a template. But what if the bulk of the text is shared, but just the numbers scattered throughout the text are different (for instance)? As far as I know, the only way to do it is to modularize the text into templates as much as possible. &ndash;[[User:Cuthalion|Cúthalion]] <small>([[User talk:Cuthalion|talk]])</small> 11:02, 22 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
Redirects point to 3E SRD. Is there a way to have namespace relative redirects, where <nowiki>[[foo]]</nowiki> inside the <nowiki>[[SRD]]</nowiki> context points to <nowiki>[[SRD:Foo]]</nowiki> while <nowiki>[[foo]]</nowiki> in the 4E context points to <nowiki>[[SRD4:Foo]]</nowiki>. <br />
<br />
:I don't think it's possible, but I'm willing to be proven wrong. &ndash;[[User:Cuthalion|Cúthalion]] <small>([[User talk:Cuthalion|talk]])</small> 09:55, 21 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::It would be possible with a few minor hacks. However, this will lead to a very confusing website. I am against the idea. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 10:18, 22 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
===Templates===<br />
<br />
What templates should be used to tag 3E and 4E pages?<br />
<br />
===Homebrew===<br />
<br />
Should homebrew rules be tagged by edition?<br />
<br />
:I strongly feel so. Everything is specific to a version if it falls back on D&D. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 10:26, 22 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::That depends on whether it is edition specific or not: WotC declaired that 3.5e would be compatable with 4.0e --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 06:19, 1 September 2007 (MDT)--[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 06:19, 1 September 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Im new here just signed up today but was reading through this and had something to say. According to the Dnd podcast 4ed is not fully compatible with 3.5, They imply that if you want to use a lot of stuff it will have to be updated. In fact they go so far as to say that you may even have to recreate things from the ground up. So separating old material and new material will be nessacary. I'd suggest tagging everything now 3.5. then creating a menu with two separate sections 3.5 and 4 and go through a process of reviewing and or editing the old material and copy it over to the new namespace.[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 07:16, 5 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::Not nessassaraly- look as CSs- they are mostly background stuff, therefore, they have no <br />
need of a tag for either 3.5 or 4. Deities might not, depending on rule changes. Enviroments will not, as it is mostly descriptive stuff. And they said that it would a be a case-by-case thing. Plus, changing the DnD category to 3.5e would take forever. there are about 4000 articles (I think) here. Better to leave them as DnD, and add 4e. Which has been done. And anyway, I said "compatable" not "fully compatable". They mean slightly different things: one means that some suff may need minor changes, others would need alot, the other means that you could just drop it into a game. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 09:36, 5 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
Should campaigns get their own namespace, or belong to their intended edition?<br />
<br />
:I feel that campaigns should not get their own namespaces because it would remove the items in the campaign from D&D Wiki linking schemes, etc. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 10:26, 22 August 2007 (MDT)''<br />
<br />
===Site conversion===<br />
<br />
How best to automate changes?<br />
<br />
Should 3E redirect be systematically replace with hard page references?<br />
<br />
:I'm not sure I understand the question. Can you give an example? &ndash;[[User:Cuthalion|Cúthalion]] <small>([[User talk:Cuthalion|talk]])</small> 09:55, 21 August 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::I think it means that rather than mentions of "darkvision" being linked to the darkvision page it says what page information about darkvision can be found at in the core rule books. If so, I am against the idea. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 04:09, 6 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Another 4e Option ==<br />
<br />
I can't help but feel that the cleanest solution would to be just host a completely separate wiki specifically for 4E, and just circumvent all the aforementioned issues. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 11:30, 21 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:I agree&mdash;having a separate wiki would be very clean, but it may not be as useful, since one would have to switch between the wiki for different versions of D&D. However, I am starting to like the idea... --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:24, 21 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Well, I think the ease of having a separate wiki would probably be more valuable than the "convenience" of having them together. Also, my understanding is that 4E is not nearly so compatible with 3.5E. So, perhaps the "clean slate" concept would be much better. --[[User:Skwyd|Skwyd]] 10:02, 22 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::From what I'm reading it seems like it'll about as compatible as 2e is to 3e.<br />
:::Also, let's not forget that the above issues are merely the ones of which we can conceive. With projects this size, more issues always arise after implementation.<br />
:::4ed20wiki.com anyone? —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 19:36, 27 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::Wizards did say 4e would be compatible with 3e with a minor amount of modification. Why not have two sub-main pages within this wiki? On the main page you have links to 3rd edition D20 and 4th edition D20. Then each edition could have it's own sub-main page just like our current main page... That would be ''like'' two wikis but without the flicking from wiki to wiki, having two accounts, and the possibility of reduced number of edits on each wiki. Personally, I think it would be better to have one wiki with separate sections. We already have modern and D&D with separate sections on one wiki, so why not do it with 3e and 4e? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 11:16, 28 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::I agree w/ Sam, we should just include a sub-set for D&D 4E like we did for d20 Modern. That way people can have just one account and since 3.5 will be compatible w/ 4E people can still look at all of our 3.5 Stuff and port it over to 4E. Just Create a Dungeons and Dragons 4E Page and a 4ESRD and everything's fine. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 11:21, 28 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::I know that the "official" announcement was that 4E would be compatible with 3E, however, I've listened to the Podcasts, read much of the forum boards, and tried to pay attention to what is out there and I don't think it will be that compatible. In fact, Dave Noonan said on the D&D Podcast that there won't be a simple process to take a 3E character and just equate it to 4E. The level progression is different, the spread of powers associated with each level will change for each of the classes, and many of the class abilities (especially spell casting) are being changed greatly. Also, monsters are being reworked extensively, and many of the mechanics are being revised, rewritten, or scrapped entirely. I have a feeling that the compatibility will be simply that you can take a story line from a 3E adventure and use it, but the mechanics, though familiar, are not the same. --[[User:Skwyd|Skwyd]] 09:55, 30 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::I still think one wiki would be best. Plus, I have also been reading the announcements, and I think a lot of the things can already be achieved with variants: the saves working like ACs, for example, add 10 to each save, take 10 from the DC, and roll a D20 and add the DC, compare to save. Easy. Critical spells? I have already done a variant for that before they announced it in Design and development. It is on this site under the title [[Spellcasting (DnD Variant Rule)|Spellcasting]]. So 3E-4E conversion could be a case of slight modification using variant rules. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 10:31, 30 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::::I'm not sure I see exactly how variants address the issue of hosting materials for two different versions of the d20 System. Are you suggesting that for every 4E rule component that's different from the corresponding 3.5 rule, it be put under the [[DnD Rules]] or a SRD Variant section? And if so, would this be in addition to or instead of hosting 4E SRD in it's own space?<br />
::::::::And since the d20 Modern section was brought up, I never really cared for it being hosted next to the d20 stuff. Admittedly, it hasn't been a problem, but that could be due to the fact that there's far fewer users using that section than the d20 section (if the amount of user-submitted material is any indication). Whether or not 4E material has it's own wiki, I'm definitely against the 4E d20 Modern and d20 Future being hosted on the same wiki.<br />
::::::::With the issue of multiple accounts, there's a way to have only one account apply to both wikis. I created an account on a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] site a while ago, and it works with all wikis there. [[User:Blue Dragon|Blue]] would know how complicated such a thing would be to accomplish, and if it'd be worth while. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 11:20, 30 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::::The answer to your question is no, I was merely stating that I think 3E will be compatible with 4E with a minimal of rule conversion. If we can have one account on two seperate wikis, would it be possible to have a single user page (and talk page) for '''BOTH''' wikis? I knows you have seperate pages on wikia... and have links between wikis work as an "inside" link rather than an "external link"? If so, then having two wikis '''Would''' be more... better. Erm... More... practical. Although if we could have a united main page for both that lead to each seperate wiki, that would be good too. About 4E modern and D20 future, starwars ect, ect, yadda yadda yadda, I am not really bothered about them. So long as we have 3E and 4E D&D (and 3E modern would be good, although we could '''completely''' replace it with 4E modern), then I am happy. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 15:25, 30 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::::::I have strengthened and decided my view, I am against two wikis for a number of reasons. One is that people would have two user pages, two talk pages, and two recent changes lists would exist. It would become a lot to handle. Another reason is that it would divide visitors between two sites, making it look like dandwiki.com is actually not doing as well as it would be, therefore making it not as popular on google, etc. Another reason I am against it is that people will choose one wiki they like and stick with it, disabling half of our growing user base. It would stop prompting people to join random discussions as much, and stop prompting them to help out as much. Another reason is that structure changes would have to be done twice, the same template made two times, one for each wiki. It seems, to me, like a lot more problems would arise than good would come out of it. I am against making two wikis.<br />
::::::::::A solution I see to this problem is namespaces. We could have namespaces such as 3.5e, 4e, 3.5eSRD, and 4eSRD to eliminate confusion as to which version something is. I think namespaces would be the best solution to this problem, not separate wikis. Maybe we should vote? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:00, 30 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::Sure. Why not? —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 21:25, 31 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::::::::Done. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:19, 31 October 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::::If anyone can see a way to make the voting table below clearer please do. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:32, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
{{Discussion Indentation Revert}}<br />
<br />
:I voted for everything. That's because I believe that we will need our whole toolbox to sort this out.<br />
:First, we need to identify the two idea complicating this discussion and table them. I believe that D20 Modern will be best served with it's own sister wiki. Simply by separating it, we greatly simplify our discussion. It then becomes its own discussion (which it deserves). Campaigns also deserves their own discussion. <br />
:This greatly simplifies our problem. <br />
:We already know that we will need new templates for 4.0. (Fact: see the new creature layout block.) We will also need new page preloads. Layout differences will help us tell one page from another. The new class pages will look different than the old class pages simply by being laid out differently. That does the same job as a skin. We also have footer and header templates that can go into a preload and existing pages.<br />
:Namespaces are powerful tools to help us sort out what is what, even at a glance. They provide an absoluteness that chains through everything. The new SRD will most definitely be in a new namespace. For contributor content, I don't see a powerful enough need for a separate namespace when layouts and templates are already providing us good service. Page titles also convey information. '''Page Title (DnD Page)''' is different from '''Page Title (4E Page)'''. <br />
:Categories will be directly impacted by namespaces, but the purpose of categories is not in separating pages, but in collecting like pages. If we try to separate pages too much using Categories, all we do is create a complicated set of categories. We have page titles and namespaces to help a user identify what page goes with which system. These should be sufficient.<br />
:Finally, there is ignorance. If we make the wiki too complex for contributors, we will lose contributors. Any schema that we invent must be apparent to our average contributor.<br />
:That's alot, isn't it?<br />
:My belief is that we should make a new namespace for the new SRD, and let the body of the wiki sort itself out with layouts, footers, and linking. Most sections are clearly one edition or the other. The trouble sections (D20 Modern and Campaigns) need their own discussions to sort out. --[[User:Dmilewski|Dmilewski]] 07:52, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::If I didn't know better, I'd swear you were putting together an argument for separate wikis. I think this statement sums it up:<br />
<br />
:::''If we make the wiki too complex for contributors, we will lose contributors.''<br />
<br />
::There's going to be plenty to worry about with just dealing with one edition without having to worry about how keep the editions separate, and too many of the solutions depend on the users maintaining the separation. Right now we have users assigning incorrect categories or neglecting categories, putting non-SRD material in the SRD namespace, not using the preloads, not putting the " (DnD xxxx)" identifier (or putting the wrong identifier) when they create a page, and so on and so on. Trying to maintain a separation between editions is going to add to the problem. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 10:45, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Nothing on this earth will stop the symptoms above. Ignorance will always exist. I believe the above are symptoms of too-few editors. We have needed editors patrolling their own areas for a while. We must also admit to ourselves that editing is not very interesting to most of our contributors. I really don't know how to address that issue.<br />
:::One reason that I don't want separate wikis is that our Campaign section is always among the most popular sections. How do I maintain Wikiworld across two wikis? If our solutions won't work well for campaigns, we will hurt ourselves.--[[User:Dmilewski|Dmilewski]] 15:09, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::Also, on the incorrect editing, most random people who post here don't know all the catagories or how to properly code a wiki. I still don't know all the catagories but I usually go find a page that does and copy and paste. So the incorrect editing will always be a problem. I also firmly stand behind the idea of just one wiki, everything in one place. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 15:28, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::I agree with Dmilewski. Why was the last sysop elected more than half a year ago? It's because we have a large issue with people not wanting to edit the infrastructure of this site. The last editor that really edited the infrastructure was [[User:Mkill|Mkill]] (albeit with some very controversial edits), who since that time has left D&D Wiki. The infrastructure is not perfect here, many many things need to be improved or are currently wrong, but why is no one stepping up and fixing them? Is D&D Wiki to complex for people to handle? Should we dumb it down? And how do the questions I just asked pertain to 4e material?<br />
:::::Actually, I think the questions I just asked are the core of this issue. A new 4e wiki will eliminate all the issues with people not wanting to edit the infrastructure, and that is why it seems so appealing. It will make a new slate, without D&D Wiki's insane hierarchy (which, by the way, only exists because average users do not edit the infrastructure or help other people's creations on D&D Wiki), and without all of the work that needs to be done on D&D Wiki that is not getting done (publications, dplc's for races, modernizing classes layouts, linking orphaned pages, etc, etc). D&D Wiki has issues, and a new 4e wiki will remove them all... but I don't like to run from my problems.<br />
:::::Yes, D&D Wiki needs some major changes to become what I envision it to be; to become what everyone envisions it to be, but I feel we can accomplish these changes within this current wiki, and just this current wiki. Problems will arise from adding a new edition, but we can solve these problems, we will need to solve these problems... and, of course, the best way to solve these problems is to solve the problem with the average user not editing the infrastructure, because that is where I feel it all stems from. If the average editor feels that D&D Wiki does not just need more content, but rather needs infrastructure help, organizational help, help with making things look good, and help with making everything balanced, then with everyones hard work all the problems on D&D Wiki will soon disappear, creating an environment where adding a new edition will be as smooth as adding a new race. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:29, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::Well not everyone wants to just go on a site and edit the way it works just for fun. They might add something but I wouldn't expect them to edit it. Maybe you should try on the equipment page to when you add a new item show some of the various templetes you can use such as the author one and the various catagories you can use. This might help because then you can just copy and paste what you need. I do agree that if we had more people editing and making things right the first or second time then this place would run much smoother. Now I would like to step up and help edit and my area would be the equipment section as I spend most my time there and I am most familar with it. You still might have to make more minor edits to what I have done but I garentee you that there will be less of them. Also, all I would be doing is standardizing and making minor edits as I do not know how to code much more than that; I could learn but that will take time. If you would like me to try to do that I will, it's just anywhere else and I'm not going to be nearly as useful. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 21:18, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::I really didn't for my post to be a ''"plea for help"'' (even though it may have come off like that... ''':P'''), but if you want to do something which requires little or no wiki-syntax knowledge thats helps out [[DnD Equipment]] please drop a note on my user-talk page and I will help you find something that needs to get done on [[DnD Equipment]]. Anyway... back to the subject on hand..... --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:57, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::::When does the vote end? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 10:38, 14 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::Does the 5th of December sound okay? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 11:45, 2 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::Yeah. I think everybody who wants a vote has voted or will have done by then. We can always send a MOI to people who havent voted. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 10:26, 3 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::Okay, the vote is over. Thanks to everyone that voted, and it appears that we will not be making a separate wiki for 4e material (or holding a book burning convention) but rather organize the different edition by way of categories, namespaces, and possibly changing the identifier. Agiain, thanks to everyone that voted ''':)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 17:05, 5 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::::So, when are we going to start setting it up for 4e? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 13:40, 15 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::::Feel free to start whenever you have time... --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 21:04, 15 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
{{Discussion Indentation Revert}}<br />
<br />
:I'd love to, but what do we call the new pages... "4E Dungeons and Dragons", "4E D20 Modern", "4E DnD Base Classes"? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 09:03, 16 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::Or "Dungeons and Dragons (4E)?" There's still a few more details that need to be decided. In what namespace will user content be? Main or "4E"? How do we deal with items independent of rules versions (i.e. maps, campaigns and the like)?<br />
::Personally, I think we can mirror the 3.5 section by replacing all the instances of "DnD" in all the identifiers with "4E" instead (e.g. "4E Character Options," "4E Feats," "4E Creatures," etc...), and the landing page can just be "Fourth Edition." (I always though "Dungeons and Dragons" and "DnD" were bit of misnomers in this context.) —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 10:37, 16 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::Ok. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 12:33, 16 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::I'll start setting it up under 4E Homebrew, 4E Feats, etc. We can move them if need be. If we have stuff under 4E as you suggested, I think DnD should be replaced with 3E or 3.5E for the 3.5 stuff... Thoughts? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 02:18, 22 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::Started to set it up- see [[4E Homebrew|this page]]. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 09:17, 22 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
=== The 4e Movement ===<br />
<br />
I looked over the page and I feel there are a couple kinks to be worked out. First off do we want the pages being labeled as "4E" or "4e"? Secondly, which pages do we want to work with both editions? Should these pages keep the "DnD" while all the other pages would adopt a 3.5e or 4e, respectively, identifier? Thirdly, should we change the descriptions of the sub-pages to say which edition they cover or would that be redundant? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 11:35, 22 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:I think 4e, Maps, campaign settings, possibly deities (depending on changes), Environments, Possibly Quests and Disscussion could be shared, yes, they keep DnD, rest become 3.5e or 4e, yes the rest need to say edition sub-pages cover. Any thoughts? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 13:34, 22 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::Yes. How can we make the newly implemented dpl on [[Dungeons and Dragons]] (thank you so much, Sledged) work with non-specific edition pages in all the main categories (for DM's, for Players, or General)? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:27, 24 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::Give pages that work for both two categories? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 06:08, 27 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::[[DnD Campaign Settings|Campaign Settings]], [[DnD Links|Links]], [[DnD Guidelines|Guidelines]], etc. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 21:37, 27 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::Ok, I have done everything except the spells section and the SRD. I have made a 4e version of the pages that I was not sure of (quests and deities), and linked to both (we delete the 4e one if not required or remove the category if the 4e one is required). What do you think? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 09:27, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::One thing is that everything could be piped so it does not say "4e" all the time. I feel that if one is already on the 4e landing page then having 4e before everything would just come off as repetitive. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 11:19, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::What do you mean? Like 4e Homebrew/Classes/Base Classes? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 06:51, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::Not exactly. I was refering to things like [[4e Deities]] being piped to [[4e Deities|Deities]]. It just seems repetitive to be on the 4e page and have everything say 4e before it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 17:43, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::Ok. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 10:18, 25 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::[in a robotic voice] TASK COMPLETE. Are there any more tasks to be done on the 4e Homebrew section? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 05:24, 27 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::Other than the spells section I really do not see anything else. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:20, 28 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::::Good. Shall we set up the 4e SRD section in the same way so we can just get on with transcribing it when 4e comes out? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 06:58, 3 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::::I read somewhere that WotC will not be releasing a 4e SRD. I think we need verify or disprove this and then decide what to do from that point. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 09:47, 4 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
{{Discussion Indentation Revert}}<br />
<br />
:[http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/4news/20080108a 4E SRD and OGL]. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 10:46, 4 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::"All of the material included in the OGL Designer’s Kit will be available for free starting on June 6, 2008. Parties who find the cost prohibitive can begin developing their products at that time." I guess that means we're able to have the SRD for 4e! --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 07:20, 5 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
===Vote===<br />
<br />
{| class="d20" style="text-align: left;"<br />
|+ 4e Solution &mdash; Voting (Please use "#" and extra lines to separate)<br />
! rowspan="2" | For making a new wiki to encompass 4e material !! colspan="6" | For keeping D&D Wiki as a whole, encompassing all editions !! rowspan="2" | Launch a book-burning party which has the goal of burning every 4e book<br />
|-<br />
! Think namespaces are the solution to 4e material !! Think categories are the solution to 4e material !! Think changing the identifier is the solution to 4e material !! Think changing the background color/skin is the solution to 4e material !! Think templates are the solution to 4e material !! Think that more than one of the aforementioned solutions is the best solution for 4e material (Please say which ones would work best together)<br />
|-<br />
|<br />
# [[User:Sledged|Sledged]] (w/ New Skin)<br />
# [[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] (What in the current wiki would we want to link to with 4e? That is the only reason I see for keeping it together... Besides usernames I suppose.)<br />
| <br />
# [[User:Sol|Sol]] <br />
# [[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]]<br />
| <br />
# [[User:Trogdor|Trogdor]]<br />
|<br />
|<br />
|<br />
|<br />
# [[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] (Namespaces (for SRD material), Categories, Changing the identifier (for homebrew material))<br />
# [[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] (Namespaces, Catagories)<br />
# [[User:Dmilewski|Dmilewski]] (All the above)<br />
# [[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] (Namespaces, Categories)<br />
# [[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] (Namespaces, Skin)<br />
# [[User:Pirate-Sorcerer|Pirate-Sorcerer]] (Namespaces, Categories)<br />
# [[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]] (Namespaces, Categories)<br />
# [[User:OptimizationFanatic|OptimizationFanatic]] (Namespaces, Categories)<br />
|<br />
# [[User:xidoraven|xido]] (lacking respect for corporate global capitalism)<br />
# [[User:Othtim|othtim]] - I *like* ''finger of death''.<br />
|}<br />
<br />
::The option to destroy all D&D4e books in the world is not an option. I am upset about this --[[User:Mander|Mander]] 19:20, 30 November 2007 (MST))<br />
<br />
:::LOL! Of course we can't take that action, even if we want to! It is probably unlawful or something. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 05:12, 1 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::That option has been added ''';)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 21:09, 2 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::'''LETS GO N' BURN THINGS!!!''' [loads AK47] '''UPRISING AGAINST THE 4E MENACE!!!''' --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 10:28, 3 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::So... tempted... to burn.... withholding... vote til I can... stop talking... like... Shatner... -- [[User:Eiji|Eiji]] 14:49, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
== New Look ==<br />
<br />
I feel that it is high time that we had a new look for the [[Main Page]], for a number of reasons. One is to make it easier for the average user to understand how D&D Wiki is organized, another is so the [[Main Page]] looks nicer. Below is my proposed idea, which is still in the works. Also, I have a couple of questions about it. One, should we use DPL2C to determine the number of items in an area. For example around <DPL2C><br />
category=DnD<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items exist in [[Dungeons and Dragons]], should we display that below? Also, should we have bullets in front of the link to [[Dungeons and Dragons]], the [[System Reference Document]], etc? Does it look better or worse with them present? Finally, how is the wording of everything? What could be improved? (P.S. the below idea is not mine, it was stolen from [[User:Sledged|Sledged]]'s hard work making [[Dungeons and Dragons]] look nice&mdash;I do not want to take credit which I do not deserve) --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:23, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Yea, the above does look much nicer than the current Main Page, and I do agree it needs an update. As for showing how many things you have in each, that's not necessary but is interesting to see that we have 2900 Homebrew Items, if anything that might bring people in to see that this is a pretty big site and not just some random long forgotten website. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 14:33, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::I have added the number of items to the new look. Any other ideas? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:28, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::This definitely clarified what information is contained in the sections. I would agree with implementing it. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 15:34, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::Let's absolutely add this. The main page definitely needs more information. I like it! &ndash;[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]] 16:48, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::I think that if we have 3.5e and 4e on this site, we should have the main page sperating out 3.5e and 4e, and pages for 3.5e and 4e like the above. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 11:56, 2 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::Yes, I agree. But that can be added once 4E comes out... &ndash;[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]] 16:30, 2 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::I'm going to implement this now because I think it is so much better (and I want it as soon as possible). Please, though, continue to post comments here about any revisions we could do to make it look better! &ndash;[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]] 16:32, 2 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::::Yeah, I like it. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 04:38, 3 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::::I removed the "d20M" in that SRD link since it is already under the header of d20M. However, I agree, it looks very good and thanks for implementing it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:48, 3 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
{| cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" class="column"<br />
|-<br />
|<br />
; <big>Dungeons and Dragons</big><br />
* [[Dungeons and Dragons|Homebrew Content]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">New classes, equipment, feats, races, creatures, deities, etc. (<DPL2C><br />
category=DnD<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
* [[System Reference Document|The System Reference Document]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">Everything published by WotC that we are allowed to have on D&D Wiki. (<DPL2C><br />
category=SRD<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
; <big>d20 Modern</big><br />
* [[D20 Modern|Homebrew Content]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">New classes, equipment, feats, races, creatures, deities, etc. (<DPL2C><br />
category=D20M<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
* [[Modern System Reference Document|The System Reference Document]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">Everything published by WotC that we are allowed to have on D&D Wiki. (<DPL2C><br />
category=MSRD<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
|}<br />
<br />
====Main Page after 4e comes out====<br />
<br />
When 4e does come out, we could change it to this:<br />
<br />
; <big>Dungeons and Dragons</big><br />
* [[Dungeons and Dragons| 3.5e Homebrew Content]] | [[4e Homebrew| 4e Homebrew Content]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">New classes, equipment, feats, races, creatures, deities, etc. (<DPL2C><br />
category=DnD<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
* [[System Reference Document|The 3.5e System Reference Document]] | [[4e System Reference Doccument|The 4e System Reference Document]] | [[UA:Variant Rules|Unearthed Arcana]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">Everything published by WotC that we are allowed to have on D&D Wiki. (<DPL2C><br />
category=SRD|Unearthed Arcana<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
<br />
; <big>d20 Modern</big><br />
* [[D20 Modern|Homebrew Content]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">New classes, equipment, feats, races, creatures, deities, etc. (<DPL2C><br />
category=D20M<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
* [[Modern System Reference Document|The System Reference Document]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">Everything published by WotC that we are allowed to have on D&D Wiki. (<DPL2C><br />
category=MSRD<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
<br />
Any thoughts? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 09:23, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:Or this...?<br />
:; <big>Dungeons and Dragons</big><br />
:; Revised 3rd Edition<br />
:* [[Dungeons and Dragons|Homebrew]] <div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">New classes, equipment, feats, races, creatures, deities, etc. (<DPL2C><br />
category=DnD<br />
category=3.5e<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
:* [[System Reference Document|The System Reference Document]] | [[UA:Variant Rules|Unearthed Arcana]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">Everything published by WotC that we are allowed to have on D&D Wiki. (<DPL2C><br />
category=SRD|Unearthed Arcana<br />
category=3.5e<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
:; 4th Edition<br />
:* [[4e Homebrew|Homebrew]] <div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">New classes, equipment, feats, races, creatures, deities, etc. (<DPL2C><br />
category=DnD<br />
category=4e<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
:* [[System Reference Document|The System Reference Document]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">Everything published by WotC that we are allowed to have on D&D Wiki. (<DPL2C><br />
category=SRD<br />
category=4e<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
<br />
:; <big>d20 Modern</big><br />
:* [[D20 Modern|Homebrew Content]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">New classes, equipment, feats, races, creatures, deities, etc. (<DPL2C><br />
category=D20M<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
:* [[Modern System Reference Document|The System Reference Document]]<div style="font-size: smaller; margin-left: 2em;">Everything published by WotC that we are allowed to have on D&D Wiki. (<DPL2C><br />
category=MSRD<br />
order=ascending<br />
</DPL2C> items)</div><br />
:--[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 11:17, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::Yeah, that is better than mine. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 06:52, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::Is everyone okay with that look once 4e comes out? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:12, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::I actually prefer Sam's layout although perhaps UA could have it's own line. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 07:36, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::I think Green Dragon's looks better. Sorry Sam ''';-)''' --[[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]] 08:38, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::I don't mind. As I said earlier, I prefer GDs. I've had a thought; I think we could, and probably should, put the link to the 4th edition homebrew (and possibly the SRD, though we can't put it up yet, for obvious reasons) on the main page, because, as people in ENworld have proved, we have enough preveiw material from the PHB Lite (derived from the pregenerated characters and rogue preview) to make some powers, the 1st level for classes, and odd things here-and-there. As ENworld is already doing odd bits of 4e homebrew based on previews, we might as well provide a place for it to go now, rather than later. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 10:37, 18 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::Please see [[Talk:Main Page#4th Edition Link|below]]. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 00:17, 5 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Should we make CAPTCHA's present after an IP edits? ==<br />
<br />
Recently a high level of automated spam has been attacking D&D Wiki in the form of inserting nonsense and gibberish into random pages. An example would be [[DnD Flaws]] as of 04:08, 1 November 2007 (MDT) as edited by [[Special:Contributions/200.226.134.53|200.226.134.53]] (permanent link [http://www.dandwiki.com/w/index.php?title=DnD_Flaws&oldid=159600 here]). I think the easiest way to stop this problem would be to provide [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha CAPTCHA's] every time an IP makes an edit. The only reason I am asking this is because I am not sure if it would be more beneficial or more harmful to have CAPTCHA's. Do you guys think that IP's would still correct spelling errors if they had to enter a CAPTCHA or would they deem it to difficult? Would it, even if the amount of edits performed by IP's decreased, be worth it? Any ideas would be appreciated. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:41, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Well, if they were just doing it because they were bored then having to spell the correct word to finalize the edit might prevent some people because they are just waaay to lazy. It would also prevent if anyone wanted to create a bot to spam content. Although, it would be annoying for me to have to do that every time I wanted to say, update my User Page with another new item. If you could disable it for users and not IP's, I think that would be a good try to cut down on the spam. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 14:31, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::The CAPTCHA's would ''only'' be for IP edits, not for when a user edits something. Anyway, that would be terrible if a user had to enter a CAPTCHA to edit something (the reason they would not have to is because to create an account one has to enter a CAPTCHA...) Also, as you may have noticed, all the recent spam attackes have been automated, so hopefully if this is implemented it should help with the problem... --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 14:44, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::So yea, try it and we'll see if the spam goes down. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 15:24, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::I agree with this completely. Should I go ahead and put them in, or should we wait for more users to comment? &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 15:33, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::Go for it ''':)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:41, 1 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::Yeah. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 11:52, 2 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::Okay, it has been added. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 20:50, 2 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::::For some odd reason, i have had a captcha come up after all my edits today, despite the fact the captcha is only supposed to come up when an IP edits something (and I am logged in). Why is this, and can someone sort it please? Thanks. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 05:03, 3 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::::This should not be happening. I would recommend doing the following: log out, clear your browser cache, clear your browser history, clear all cookies relating to D&D Wiki, restart your browser, and then log back in and see if it is still giving you troubles. If it is, then I will definitely look into this problem further. I am sorry for the inconvenience that this is causing you, and will try to get it sorted out as soon as is possible. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 13:50, 3 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::::::It has not worked. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 15:39, 3 November 2007 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::Maybe you're an IP in disguise... ''':P'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:17, 4 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::::Err... no. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 11:55, 5 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::::Okay... Can I change your password (through the database) and login as you to asses the problem? I would like to see what is happening and hopefully give [[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] enough information to fix this very strange problem. Would this be okay with you? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:41, 5 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
{{Discussion Indentation Revert}}<br />
<br />
:Yeah, sure. Can you change my password back afterwards though, please? Thanks. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 08:11, 6 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::Am I the only one getting the problem? --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 08:23, 6 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::No, I also experienced this today with my edits. Although, I'm behind a corporate firewall here, so I don't know if that has anything to do with it. --[[User:Skwyd|Skwyd]] 09:25, 6 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::No, I've gotten one after every edit I've made, even if it was just adding one letter. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 14:15, 6 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::Oops... I guess the setting was set so sysops were the only ones who did not have to give a CAPTCHA whereas everyone else did. The issue should now be fixed, and sorry about that... --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:22, 6 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::Much better. ''':D''' Now I can reformate the equipment section in peace. Which as an update I've finished nearly all the back to footers and have all but the magic weapons and over half the wondrous items updated to the MIC format. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 20:42, 6 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::Yeah, sorted. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 11:59, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::Glad to hear it ''':)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:44, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
== Move towards new DPL ==<br />
<br />
Hello all, this site is running on a very outdated version of DPL, which has caused several hacks to have to be thrown together, and is potentially not allowing things to get done. When I upgraded this wiki to v11, I upgraded DPL as well, but most all pages that used DPL immediately stopped working. Is there an interest for me to get a test wiki running, and people can figure out how the DPL should be working, and then implement it? Or should we instead stick with what we have and wait until we really need the next version? &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 15:07, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:I honestly have no idea what the DPL is. So could someone tell me what it is and/or what it does? Then I could answer your questions. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 15:27, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::What are the new features of the new DPL version? For most purposes, the DPLs seem to be working well, but I know we've especially had to hack some DPL2 stuff. Would the new version fix this? [Watsyurname529, DPLs are dynamically assembled lists generally based off of category tags, e.g. [http://www.dandwiki.com/w/index.php?title=User_Base_Classes&action=edit this code] yields [http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/User_Base_Classes this page].] &ndash;[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]] 18:21, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::I feel that we should implement the new dpl version. The DPL2 (at least according to [[User:Sledged|Sledged]]) would make it so we would not need three main different modifications of the dpl to be running on this site, the dpl, dplc, and the dpl2c (full list [[Special:Version|here]]). I think it would help D&D Wiki greatly to implement the newest version of the dpl, and make things easier for a new user to understand. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:48, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::There's a demo site for DPL with a manual [http://semeb.com/dpldemo/index.php?title=Main_Page here].<br />
::::Is there a way to get a list of all the pages using dpl*? —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 16:29, 8 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::[[MediaWiki:Pages using DPL]] is what True Orphans uses. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 18:17, 8 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::It's only listing the pages in the main/default namespace. What about the SRD pages? —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 14:58, 13 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::The extension that page is for specifically excludes all SRD dpl pages, so those have never been added to that dpl list. We will have to compile a list on our own for SRD pages. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 19:54, 14 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::I see. Also, when I said "pages using <tt>dpl*</tt>," I meant also the <tt>dpl2c</tt>, <tt>dplc</tt>, and <tt>dpl2cu</tt> tags. I don't see any of the pages using those tags listed. If those pages can be identified before hand, it'll make an upgrade a bit easier. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 12:48, 15 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::To answer [[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]]'s first question. This wiki is running version 0.7.7 of DPL2. The latest version is 1.5.2, so there is a significant number of changes. For brevity, I'll just list a few of the new features that apply to this wiki:<br />
:::*You can specify your own format for the output. For example you could list each result as a row in a table instead of getting the standard three column output.<br />
:::*In conjunction with the previous feature, DPL2 pull content from the listed pages for displaying as part of the output.<br />
:::*You can get results based on pages names and page content in addition to categories and namespaces. For instance, all the [[DnD Prestige Classes|user PrCs]] are assigned to the category beginning with the first letter of the page title. Those categories can be completely removed because DPL2 lets you return pages whose title's first letter matches one specified in the DPL2 call.<br />
:::*DPL2 can used to compensate for user error. Broken links like the one titled "Anima and Animus Mage" on the [[DnD Prestige Classes|user PrCs page]] can be eliminated.<br />
:::*With the latest version of DPL2 (an one other specific extension) users can create spell/feat/monster/etc filters like the one seen [http://www.penpaperpixel.org/tools/d20spellfilter/ here].<br />
:::*It can be used as a parser function (which I personally prefer over tags).<br />
:::*Pages that are linked to only from DPL calls are not listed as [[Special:Lonelypages|orphaned pages]].<br />
:::—[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 14:58, 13 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::Okay, lets do it. What are the changes that need to be made to dpl pages to make this not be broken when implemented? What is the best way of going about this change? Should we change the pages first, then implement it, or implement it then fix all the errors on the dpl pages? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 19:54, 14 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::There's one more complication to take into consideration; All the pages with the <tt>dpl*</tt> mod tags (<tt>dpl2c</tt>, <tt>dplc</tt>, and <tt>dpl2cu</tt>) have to be changed, not just list pages. So we'll have to go through all the class pages (base, prestige, npc, and racial paragon) and NPC pages. I think Blue's suggestion of a test wiki is the best way to do it. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 12:48, 15 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::It might not be necessary to set up a test wiki. I [http://semeb.com/dpldemo/index.php?title=Issue:No_More_Globals submitted a request] over at the [http://semeb.com/dpldemo/index.php?title=Main_Page DPL2 site] to transition all the globals to class members. If Gero decides to adopt it, the latest version and the currently installed version can be installed side-by-side without one conflicting with the other. The only caveat is that the line that reads<br />
<br />
::::::<pre>$wgParser->setHook( "DPL", array( __CLASS__, "dplTag" ) );</pre><br />
<br />
::::::in the new version will have to be commented out. This will disable using new version as a tag extension, but it will still be available as a parser function call; <tt>{<nowiki/>{#dpl:}}</tt>. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 12:23, 21 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::And [http://semeb.com/dpldemo/index.php?title=Main_Page DPL2] version 1.6.0 (no more globals) has been released. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 09:42, 25 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::Okay, I upgraded to the latest version. Let me know if there are any errors. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 12:18, 25 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
=== A Small Sample ===<br />
<br />
So here's a sample list of the user base classes, which I've limited to the 'A's:<br />
<br />
{| class="d20" style="text-align: left;"<br />
|+ Homebrew Base Classes with Descriptions<br />
|- {{#vardefine:odd|0}}<br />
! Name !! style="text-align: center;" | Balance<sup>[[#1|1]]</sup> (out of 10) !! Type<sup>[[#2|2]]</sup> !! Description<sup>[[#3|3]]</sup><br />
{{#dpl:category=DnD<br />
|titlematch=A%<br />
|category=User<br />
|category=Base Class<br />
|include={Balance}:1,{x0}:type:desc<br />
|mode=userformat<br />
|format=,¦- ²{#vardefine:odd¦²{#ifexpr: ²{#var:odd}²¦0¦1}²}²²{#ifexpr: ²{#var:odd}²¦¦class="even"}²\n¦ [[%PAGE%¦²{#replace:%PAGE%¦(DnD Class)¦}²]]\n,,<br />
|tablerow=¦style="text-align: center;" ¦ ²{#if: %%¦%%¦NR}²,\n¦%%,%%\n<br />
}}|-<br />
| colspan="7" class="foot" |<br />
# <span id="1">Shows how balanced a certain Class is, the number is out of 10. The Balance rating is from the actual Class's page; it is not made on this page. More information [[Balance System|here]].</span><br />
# <span id="2">A general category the Class fits into. e.g. Strong Spellcasting, Combat Focused, etc.</span><br />
# <span id="3"> A concise description of the Class-- should advertise the Class.</span><br />
|}<br />
—[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 13:59, 27 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:I like it ''':)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 21:27, 29 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:: The Alchemist... I don't know if i would consider it a spell caster --[[User:Cerin616|Cerin616, Drew]] 15:58, 11 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::Better now? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:20, 11 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
== 4,000th Item! ==<br />
<br />
Whoo! I just posted the 4,000th homebrew item on this site! Amazing how much stuff we've got on here. Just want to say congrats to everyone who's posted/edited here. Also here is the 4,000th item: [[Fried Frying Pan (DnD Equipment)|Fried Frying Pan]] --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 15:29, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:If that number is correct.... ''':P'''. I think we may actually have more, they are just not categorized (that number is actually the number of items in [[:Category:DnD]]). Although, I agree. Congratulations all! --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:51, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::Hey, it says 4000 Items on the main page and that's good enough for me ''':P''' to you too, lol. --[[User:Watsyurname529|Watsyurname529]] 20:56, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::Meh... ''':)'''. Also, if you want to make that number more accurate please take a look at the [[Special:TrueOrphans|TrueOrphans]] (which may not be true&mdash;I think [[MediaWiki:Pages_using_DPL]] needs to be updated...). However, feel free to categorize those things and, overall, make things on D&D Wiki be linked to! --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 21:14, 7 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
==Sidebar Change==<br />
Dungeons and Dragons or Homebrew?<br />
<br />
The side bar has an option called "Dungeons and Dragons" that takes you to the Homebrew section. This seems to me to be misleading and should be changed to "Homebrew." This is not that big of a deal, but it would be more consistant. --[[User:Mander|Mander]] 15:09, 18 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:Actually, there's more than just homebrew material there (though the vast majority of it is homebrew). It also contains OGC from source books like ''Unearthed Arcana'', ''Relics and Rituals'', ''Creature Collection'', ''Monster Manual II'', and such. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 12:38, 21 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::Currently on the [[Main Page]] we call that entire section "Homebrew Content" even though it has more than just that (as [[User:Sledged|Sledged]] pointed out above). If we want to be nitpicky, that is also a problem. Anyway, the reason it is called "Dungeons and Dragons" on the sidebar is that the sidebar cannot have any real wiki-syntax. The ideal organization for that would be something like:<br />
::D&D<br />
:::[[Dungeons and Dragons|Homebrew]] (even though it's not all homebrew...)<br />
:::[[System Reference Document|SRD]]<br />
::D20M<br />
:::[[D20 Modern|Homebrew]] (even though it's not all homebrew...)<br />
:::[[Modern System Reference Document|MSRD]]<br />
::However, that is not possible. Since that is not possible we try to do the best we can, and that is the current way. Actually, this post has given me an idea... Maybe another box, labeled "D&D" and one labeled "D20M" could exist, with the links in them... --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 14:43, 25 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::I just changed it. What does everyone think? Better? Worse? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 14:45, 25 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::I dont mean to be picky. I also dont mean to make extra work for ya all. I just through out ideas when I have them. I like the change, but I also like the reasons given above for why it was the way it was. That is why I like wiki format. I hardly ever make changes, but I do add my ideas to disscution.--[[User:Mander|Mander]] 22:44, 29 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::I hesitate to bring it up, but I think it might be worth mentioning; The D&D section could be split up into "homebrew" and "published OGC" sections. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 12:07, 30 November 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::First off you were not a bother at all, [[User:Mander|Mander]]. The sidebar is very easy to change and it's always great to improve things. Anyway, I feel that as soon as we have enough published OGC material (we are reaching it though, if one counts NBoF as "published") then we should definitely spit "DnD" up into published OGC and Homebrew. However, right now I do not think we have enough... Maybe when all the UA material is posted we can give it a shot, but until then I do not think we have enough OGC content. Your thoughts? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:48, 4 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::: So many acronyms, so few ranks in knowlege-acronyms...--[[User:Mander|Mander]] 01:30, 5 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::Age of the internet. Soon everything we be reduced to acronyms, IMHO. [[Help:FAQ#What are OGL, OGC, SRD, and GNU FPL?|OGC]], [http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/welcome DnD], [http://datadeco.com/nbofeats/ NBoF], and [http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/881560000 UA] (which I really should finish transcribing). —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 02:31, 5 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::Actually, speaking of acronyms, it would be helpful to have a list of all the D&D acronyms in [[DnD Other]] (I am sure a list exists on the internet, it just needs to be copied over). Also, sorry about using all those acronyms above. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:31, 5 December 2007 (MST)<br />
<br />
New question: Shouldn't the [[UA:Variant Rules|UA Transcript]] be linked in the sidebar? -- [[User:OptimizationFanatic|OptimizationFanatic]] 17:02, 16 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:It should. What should we call it, Unearthed Arcana, UA, Variant SRD, or what? Ideas? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:48, 16 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::Maybe UA: Variants? -- [[User:OptimizationFanatic|OptimizationFanatic]] 08:34, 17 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::: Or "UA Variant Rules." Either one works for me. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 11:00, 17 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::I have added it. Does it look okay? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:45, 18 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::Looks great! -- [[User:OptimizationFanatic|OptimizationFanatic]] 17:01, 21 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
== Maps? ==<br />
<br />
:''Discussion moved to [[Talk:Dungeons and Dragons#New Section: Maps?]]<small> It dealt with Homebrew specific material, not everything on the site --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:52, 4 December 2007 (MST)</small><br />
<br />
== Tavern Schedule ==<br />
<br />
Should a small Tavern Schedule be placed on the main page on the right side (floating)? &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 15:40, 15 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:I think this is a good idea to increase use of the tavern, but it would be best if days that already had events planned were highlighted, a different text color, the only days with links, etc. They need to stand out; otherwise, I have to click each day to even see if there is anything that day. It almost seems to me that a mini-program/extension is needed to code that to make it more useful... still, the calendar is a great idea. That is the best suggestion I have heard to increase usage of the tavern. &ndash;[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]] 16:35, 15 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::The days that have events are blue. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 19:43, 15 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::Much better. I like it. &ndash;[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]] 20:24, 15 January 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
== New Logo ==<br />
<br />
{| align="right" class="d20"<br />
|-<br />
! Submitted Logos:<br />
|-<br />
| ''Please submit your own logo!''<br/>[[dndmedia:Special:Upload|Upload it!]]<br />
|-<br />
| [[Image:D&D logo-test1.png|frame|From Maria C.]]<br />
|-<br />
| [[Image:D&D logo-test2.png|frame|From [[User:Xidoraven|Xidoraven]]]]<br />
|-<br />
| [[Image:D&D logo-test3.png|frame|Variation 1]]<br />
|-<br />
| [[Image:D&D logo-test4.png|frame|Variation 2]]<br />
|-<br />
| [[Image:Logo.png|frame|Current logo]]<br />
|}<br />
<br />
=== Official Updates ===<br />
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Here is what will happen. A two week submission period will start now, after this time when more logos or variations have been submitted, a one week voting period will take place. So, right now, please upload all the variations of these logos or your own D&D Wiki logo and in two weeks time the D&D Wiki community will decide what the logo will become. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 12:57, 26 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:The voting for which logo should become D&D Wiki's logo will start February 9th. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:13, 29 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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=== Voting ===<br />
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{| class="d20" style="text-align: left;"<br />
|+ New Logo &mdash; Voting (Please use "#" and extra lines to separate votes)<br />
! [[Image:D&D logo-test1.png]]<br />
! [[Image:D&D logo-test2.png]]<br />
! [[Image:D&D logo-test3.png]]<br />
! [[Image:D&D logo-test4.png]]<br />
! [[Image:Logo.png]]<br />
|-<br />
! From Maria C.<br />
! From [[User:Xidoraven|Xidoraven]]<br />
! Variation 1<br />
! Variation 2<br />
! Current logo<br />
|-<br />
| <br />
#<br />
| <br />
# [[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]]<br />
# [[User:Dmilewski|Dmilewski]]<br />
# [[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]]<br />
# [[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]]<br />
# [[User:Young DM|Young DM]]<br />
# [[User:Arohanui|Arohanui]]<br />
# [[User:Othtim|Othtim]]<br />
# [[User:Mask man|Mask man]]<br />
# [[User:kreik|kreik]]<br />
# [[User:EaTCarbS|EaTCarbS]]<br />
# [[User:Lordsnarf|Lordsnarf]]<br />
| <br />
#[[User:Silver Dragon|Silver Dragon]]<br />
| <br />
#[[User:Hawk|Hawk]]<br />
#[[User:Pirate-Sorcerer|Pirate-Sorcerer]]<br />
#[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]]<br />
#[[Summerscythe]]<br />
#[[User:Wackymynd|Wackymynd]]<br />
#[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]]<br />
#[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]]<br />
| <br />
#<br />
|}<br />
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Everyone agree that we have reached a consensus? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 23:16, 24 February 2008 (MST)<br />
:Looks like we have to me 11/1/6 Xidoraven has a pretty big lead. [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 23:40, 24 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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::I believe that the vote looks pretty definitive. Please let me know if anyone ever gives you problems from Wizards.com or Hasbro, Inc. I am currently working with them in a professional capacity, so I will be able to speak for my work myself, and in direct communications to them. If they want my business, they will not harass this site for being loyal consumers and fans of a popular product line. Best of wishes to you all.<br />
::GD, if you have any more input on what we talked about before, please let me know by email. I am having a hard time getting back here to check on my pages right now. -- [[User:Xidoraven|xido]] 08:03, 25 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::Changed. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 21:24, 26 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::Looks good, everyone. Thanks for the support, and let me know if you need any other design ideas, since you may feel the need in the future to reconsider color usage, etc. Are there any ideas for what would be placed in the background area, if not the current Player's Handbook image? -- [[User:Xidoraven|xido]] 00:39, 11 March 2008 (MDT)<br />
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=== General Discussion on Submitted Logos ===<br />
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We have had two submissions for a new logo. One of them is from [[User:Xidoraven|Xidoraven]], and the other is from Maria C. Both of them are shown below, and we should decide to either keep the current logo or change to one of these. Please leave feedback. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:04, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:I like the second one. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 15:05, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::I vote for Xidoraven's. I like colorful. --[[User:Dmilewski|Dmilewski]] 15:06, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::I wonder what the first would look like with a bit more color. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 15:10, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::I really like the dragon on the first logo, however I feel that the wording on that logo may be a little hard to read. So, I think it may look very nice if both the trial logos were merged into one. The "D&D Wiki" would be cut out of the first logo and the "D&D Wiki" text from xido's image would be pasted over it, albeit a little smaller. Does anyone think this idea has some merit? Is it worth exploring further? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:35, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::::Variation 2 is great! I give that my vote. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 16:23, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
:::::On second thought... I like Variation 1. Arrrg... It is difficult because the logo seems too big with the dragon, yet too small at the same time. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 16:24, 23 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::::I like variation 2, except the logo should be moved a bit down and right so that the entire graphic is a bit more square (lest the words encroach on the dragon picture)... &ndash;[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]] 06:06, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::::::Variation 2 OR Xidoravens. Either way, it's really cool! A new logo for a new edition... --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 06:46, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::::::Variation 2 has me as well. Also, if anyone wants to compile their own variation or make their own logo please do! We need all the options we can get! --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 17:56, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::::::::My wife votes Xidoravens ''':P'''. I'm actually really not sure. I like Variation 1, 2, and Xidoravens... Perhaps we should set up an official vote? --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 18:01, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::::::::Is there going to be an "official vote" (whatever that may mean)? Variation 2 is my preferences, and I agree that it would likely look even better with the dragon picked out in red and gold. Also, whichever one is chosen, is it kosher for me to slap the logo up places (such as my blog) linking back to the wiki, as a means of promotion? --[[User:Arohanui|Arohanui]] 01:03, 26 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::::::::::I've gotta agree, but with xido's colors, I wouldn't mind seeing the dragon colored as a [[SRD:Half-Dragon|half-gold dragon]] [[SRD:Red Dragon|red dragon]]. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 21:39, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::::::::::First off I agree, if the dragon was given some color this entire logo could come out very sharp. Secondly, xido, tell me if I am wrong. You are basically saying that you would be okay to work with the dragon image if Maria C. has the same intentions you have of modifying D&D iconic images for a good cause. Since I cannot speak for Maria C. I will contact her and ask her to join this discussion to help discuss her logo and the final outcome of D&D Wiki's logo. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 00:19, 25 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::::::::::::I agree with Blue Dragon. As for my vote for the logos, I like the two combinations, particularly the second one. -- [[User:OptimizationFanatic|OptimizationFanatic]] 09:37, 26 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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{{Discussion Indentation Revert}}<br />
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:I also have to say, I really like the dragon in the middle of Xido's logo. I think that using his for the top logo, and then Maria's for a softer logo, potentially on the main page, could be used. However, I feel that a voting period should exist. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 10:30, 26 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::Definitely Version two and It shouldn't be changed a bit the black and white dragon behind the blazing dnd wiki looks awesome but as a second choice id go for Xidoraven's logo by itself<br />
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:::I like Xidoraven's original logo. [[User:Kimmuriel|Kimmuriel]] 18:39, 14 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::: Xidoraven for prez! --[[User:Othtim|Othtim]]<br />
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:::::I would make a terrible president. I would prefer project coordinator, or community shaman, but not something as pop-culture as presidente. ;) -- [[User:Xidoraven|xido]] 07:18, 16 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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Okay, how do i put my name on variation 2, that my fav :D - [[User:Zombiecow|Zombiecow]]<br />
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=== Authors Comments and Discussion ===<br />
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Font size is highly important in a logo concept, especially when they are sized down this much. I designed the font spacing and proportions with that in mind. Also, though I enjoy the integration of the two (trust me, my inner artist is inspired - not jealous), it seems a little busy, and the dragons look dim compared to the heavy vibrancy I put into the original 4e-based concept. I know it sounds haughty and rude, but I choose my own. If Miss Maria would be willing to revise her concept, I think they would more accurately meld. Her design would need the words removed fully, and would require a splash of color (like a layer over it, that appears like watercolor, or an expressive way of 'filling in the lines'). The logo I created has heavier contrast even than that of the original 4e logo design. I had not anticipated it being integrated with another black-and-white (or blank) portion. Had I known, I might have prepared an alternative. -- [[User:Xidoraven|xido]] 21:30, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:As a second thought: Here's my other dilemma.<br />
:I do not know Miss Maria, but I know that her artwork is based on Lockwood's, and that is a blatant copyright infringement of one of the most controversial materials produced by Wizards: Commissioned Artwork. ([http://wizards.com/dnd/images/MM35_gallery/MM35_PG76.jpg])<br />
:I am well aware of the fact I pulled a concept from 4e D&D corporate design, knowing full well that it might bring a lawsuit upon me. I am also communicating with the makers of Scrabulous (Scrabulous.com) currently, because I feel that what is happening right now with their product is an issue in international business ethics. I openly state that my work is a mere pseudo-forgery of Wizards own internally-produced corporate graphics, but I appreciate and respect Mr. Lockwood for being such a professional artist in his field, and cannot openly condone utilizing his work in our own endeavors. If the piece was just a tad different from the Red Dragon's stance or appearance, I could see over-looking it, but this is something that is necessary for an artist to understand up-front. I openly admit to pirating the official 4e logo design from Wizards for a good cause, but I would hope that Miss Maria would be able to do the same in her position.<br />
:That being said, the general concensus on what constitutes 'unique artwork' is at least 15% difference from the original piece. Though she has flipped the image on its vertical axis, and turned detailed painting into rough black outlines, I would think it would need just a ''tad'' more work done to it to be considered anything other than outright plagiarism. If Miss Maria is aware of my own intentions, and has the same goals of her own, then I can look the other way. I would prefer to go down alone if I am to go down as an artist. At least this way, no one can say that you paid me for my services, but that I instead gave them openly as a professional operating in the open-source markets under the GNU license.<br />
:That's my last piece. -- [[User:Xidoraven|xido]] 22:09, 24 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::Hello, this is Maria. First of all, I am not Miss Maria as you have taken a fancy of calling me. Second, I created this wood engraving without the knowledge of what's copyrighted and what is not. Green Dragon is family friend and has been nagging me for months to create a logo understanding that I am a graphic design artist. He handed me d&d books and asked me to make a logo. So I choose something cool, changed it, carved it, printed it, modified it on the computer. Green Dragon did not give any advice for this, only that it needed to be done. I wasn't told of anything so I am sorry for the copyright infringement. I also created this logo not for a profit such, but for this 'community' which may be considered a good cause since I get not one thing out of it. And xudo, you need to work on being respectful. You seem jealous that someone else has submitted artwork and that you aren't the only one with fame. 'Artists' are so competitive and always trying to be the best with their noses in the air. -Maria {{Unsigned|Xuthukzaklath|15:16, 25 January 2008 (MST)}}<br />
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:::As a friendly site note to all, I vote that the attacks should stop. This should be a logo design competition in which '''the best''' logo is chosen. There is no need to either of the creators to bicker. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 09:35, 26 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::I highly agree, BD.<br />
::::I just wanted to make my comments publicly known. I have absolutely no problem with the mods of this site asking multiple artists for their ideas. I am glad that you have put forward as well. That is how professional art works. Everyone puts forward what they have to give, and then the leaders decide which works best for what they'd like to portray the project. In this case, there were two options, plus the idea of combining. I have not a single problem with any of those ideas, and in fact wish for the mods to make their own decision. As an artist, I may seem biased. In fact, my words (including the word 'blatant') may have had a negative ring or tone to them, but I assure you that my mental inflection did not.<br />
::::I only want to make everyone aware that I have taken multiple considerations into effect in stealing elements of Hasbro's corporate logo in order to promote this open-source site's mission of helping the public. I have a SERIOUS issue with Hasbro & Mattel's current intellectual property campaign at the moment, as well as their business ethics toward third-party producers of copyrighted content. This is because of the legal drama happening with Scrabulous.com. It is for this reason that I am openly providing my professional services to the mods of this site, in order to help them, just as you, Maria, have done. I respect your position and comments. Please just know that I wanted my input to be put out there, in case you were not aware of the legal implications of that particularly recognizable image (the red dragon literally is '''''the most''''' reproduced dragon in D&D as of this year, in terms of rulebook, supplemental, and related material to the D&D brand line. To utilize this image would be a very risky and potentially harmful venture. That is my only point here. If you are okay with that risk, I am okay with it. But please note that the reasons for THAT piracy is not in any way the same as the professional stance I am making by utilizing corporate branding material from Hasbro, as opposed to the very highly recognizable works of Mr. Lockwood, whom I revere admirably as an artist.<br />
::::On a sidenote, I assumed that being a Maria, that you are a female. I could be wrong here. In the state of Louisiana, where I have recently moved to, it is customary for men in particular to respectfully call a woman of any form (whether married, divorced, single, or otherwise) 'Miss Whoever'. I was merely trying to be courteous. I hope I have not offended. That was not my intent.<br />
::::Thanks for understanding, all, and I hope that the Mods can make an adequate decision on the logo design. I would not like to seem biased, so I will leave it all up to you, having said my piece. Best wishes, -- [[User:70.172.234.38|70.172.234.38]] 19:59, 10 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::::PS - I don't want to seem pushy, but I have always had a hard time voting on this site. Perhaps making a username profile on Elftown.com, and seeing the way their own polls are set up might give you ideas for future changes. Privacy features, public features, wiki-features, and a pseudo-html are all able to be used there. I have had some really good success with hosting polls on Elftown to get input or for contests of any multiple-choice form. -- [[User:70.172.234.38|70.172.234.38]] 19:59, 10 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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=== Legality of Images ===<br />
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As to the copyright issues, I believe that the background of our skin is a WoTC copyrighted image. I feel that if we receive a cease and desist letter they will be removed, but beyond that, I feel that it should not be a major issue. Also, I have another interesting idea. I think that Xidoraven's is powerful, and in that sense alone looks quite nice. Would there be any major consideration to have the background of the main page be this dragon, or something similar? A watermark, so to speak? The second combination could also potentially be modified by Xidoraven, seeing that he would know what to do for D&D Wiki's purposes. &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 09:40, 26 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:Actually, both the skin and the logos would be covered under the free use clause of international copyright law, as it is neither being used to make money nor infringes the copyright holder's ability to sell goods. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 10:53, 26 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::Sam, I just want to say a quick word about free use (I know you like it, so I won't be too harsh). Essentially, the clause is the "wiggle room" in an otherwise extremely strict copyright law and allows for things like academic criticism, etc. However, exactly what constitues "fair use" and what constitutes "unfair use" is loosely defined in the law, and it is important that you know that the United States judicial system has historically ruled very strictly against those parties who (in their eyes) abuse the clause. So, we should tread a bit softly. However, as was said above, if we (Green Dragon, actually) is issued a cease and desist order from any company (such as those owning HALO and LotR, for example, or especially from Hasbro) then we will have to delete the content. Basically, I just want it to be noted that fair use is limited, especially within the widely respected bounds of legal precedent, so don't be too sure that certain images, etc. can be freely used under "fair use." Further, the likelyhood of abuse increases as more information is added. Thus, if I were to quote a line from the PHB as evidence in an argument, that would certainly pass litmus. The more direct and derivative information that is added, though, the more likely it is that infringement will ensue. (Please also note that all material and information derived from a copyrighted source is also [partially] owned by that source, which includes information and rules we might create for use in, for example, the HALO setting). A final note: Wizards of the Coast is renowned for its aggressive pursual in copyright infringement cases after inherited issues involving TSR, Palladium, and certain other companies, a historical precedent that everyone here should be aware of. In any case, please keep in mind that so long as there are no legal actions served we should be okay (this site is not for profit thus far, though if we begin to earn revenue from advertising this will importantly change), but&mdash;if the issue comes to a head&mdash; we will most definitely be on the losing side and will have to remove content or face court action. &ndash;[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]] 09:22, 29 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::I was aware of that. I had to do quite abit of research into it when I did LotR. I do think, however, that as there are Wikias for both LotR and Halo, neither of which have yet been sued, the CSs in question should be fine. Although the dragon thing is a definatly something we should think over carefully. Although, as we are only considering a logo, the risk is small (I think). So, yes, those things are fine for now and we can remove them if we get into trouble. The biggest problem with free use is definatly it's vagueness. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 10:05, 29 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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== Protection of Pages ==<br />
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You know this isnt much of a wiki since everything is editblocked.if someone vandalizes a page u REVERT it [[User:Zau|Zau]] 03:12, 29 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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:? Of course we revert it! Why should we let our work be spoiled by vandal? All wiki's revert vandallism. The point of a wiki is to work together to improve the whole thing, rather than to reck the whole thing by vandalism. And about those editblocked pages- those are mostly SRD, which is official material that we aren't allowed to whimsically edit. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 06:49, 29 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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::I have unlocked this page to IP edits, we will see what happens. Also, the SRD's protection is up in the air right now, if all goes well with the new UA material on D&D Wiki (which, even though it is OGC, is only protected from IP edits) then the SRD may very well become protected only from IP edits as well. If you are referring to specific GNU FLD homebrew pages that are protected, they are only protected because the author of the page is question has asked them to be protected. They will never become un-protected unless the author wishes this to happen. I hope this helps answer your question as to why so many pages on D&D Wiki are protected. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:03, 29 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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== Index of True Dragons ==<br />
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:''Discussion moved to [[Talk:True Dragon Index#Location?]]<small> as it dealt with that page. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 09:25, 8 February 2008 (MST)</small><br />
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== Published Settings ==<br />
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Hi I was wondering does anyone know whether it would be legal to publish information about old dnd settings on here or homebrew stuff for those settings ie: planescape or spelljammer? also would it be legal to do the same for the still in print settings like forgotten realms and eberron? and would anyone else be interested in stuff like this? [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 22:42, 7 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:New settings = no. Not allowed, as they aren't under the OGL (I think...). Old ones I'm not sure about. -- [[User:OptimizationFanatic|OptimizationFanatic]] 22:28, 8 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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::Probably not. The old stuff isn't under the OGL. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 13:03, 10 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::If it is licensed under the [[OGL]] please add them, however I do not think any of them are... --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 23:43, 10 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::I'm pretty sure It is technically not allowed unless we want to make fun of them in which case it falls under fair use in the copyright acts of the world lol. Does anyone know how we could find out for sure? [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 06:42, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::::They cannot be added. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 12:08, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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== Semantic MediaWiki ==<br />
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I do not pretend to understand this nor what it would take to implement but would it be possible to use something like [http://ontoworld.org/wiki/Semantic_MediaWiki] to create forms to make adding entries for new users easier. there are a number of entries that need to be formatted if a form formatted the entries for them this problem may be fixed. Although it would only help at page creation its a start. Any thoughts?<br />
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I should point out the form wouldn't replace editing the code directly just allow another option for those who have no idea how to format. Which means those who like to stare down the face of a page of code (myself included) could still do so. [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 02:25, 10 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:I've briefly grazed over that extension, and I've yet to take it for a test run, but I think you're right that there may be some useful nuggets along with the semantic forms extension (which requires semantic wiki). I'd been meaning to ask [[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] or [[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] to take it for a spin in development environments and give input on it. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 10:36, 10 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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::I think it would be useful only problem is that it needs to be added to dnd wiki then someone has to make the forms, it's a fair amount of work. [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 21:29, 10 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semantic_MediaWiki About]. Not sure if this is really what we are looking for... It, as far as I can tell, would just help with dynamic categories and act a little like the dpl2c feature we currently use. I think an external script for adding things (as [[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] is working on) may be a better option. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 23:10, 10 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::My apologies I was unclear on what I meant I'm lucky Sledged knew what I meant. Its not the semantic wiki itself that I am interested in but the [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Semantic_Forms Semantic forms extension]. As far as I understand it it allows you to 'simply' create a form to fill out and will take care of the wiki coding for you. If you scroll down to the Special Pages heading and look at the examples it will give you a better idea of what this is. [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 23:24, 10 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::::I agree with you, that is a very interesting extension, and I could see it being very useful here on D&D Wiki. The only problem I see is that, although impressive, it requires a Semantic Wiki as a prerequisite. I am not sure I would want D&D Wiki to become a Semantic Wiki, although the decision is not mine it is the communities. Maybe someone could change the code so a Semantic Wiki is not needed and it can work within the normal MediaWiki environment? That would make it quite a bit more appealing ''':)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 00:59, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::::I have not read all the material and probably wouldn't understand most of it anyway I believe it would be beyond my ken, my knowledge of wikis and php is limited. What would be involved in implementing this do you think? What would 'becoming a semantic wiki' do? You seem to have reservations I'm just wondering if there are draw backs you foresee? [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 06:25, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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:::::::I gave a look at Semantic Wiki and I think it is a great idea. In my experience as a technical writer, duplication of information is one of the Prime Evils. Namely, here was the criteria that led me to really want to add dpl to races and now feats:<br />
:::::::*All information about a particular topic should be in the same location.<br />
:::::::*Updating information should update other pages that use that information.<br />
:::::::Where I work, we use a form of documentation source files called DocBook. DocBook is much like this wiki where information must be repeated because there is no inclusion mechanism. There is another form of documentation source, which we are considering switching to after the next release of our software. This format is called Dita. Dita allows you to segment information into sections which can be included directly by other pages. This concept is partially similar to Semantic Wiki, but I would argue, less powerful. Semantic Wiki allows you to tag information as a particular type of information. It might be a little more work to create a page, but all of the sudden we have so much more power to categorize our information.<br />
:::::::On a race page, for example, we can have a "quick synopsis" type of data which users would use for a sentence that describes the race. The page could also have an "ability score adjustment" type of data and a "level adjustment" type of data. All of the x0 templates I put on the top of race pages would be unnecessary at this point. The advantage being: if a user updates the source of the race (ie: changes the Ability score adjustments from +2 str to +2 con), it will automatically change the race table without requiring the x0 template at the top of the page to be changed. This means that the information displayed in the tables will always be true to the source.<br />
:::::::The big problem with Semantic Wiki is that it would be a LOT of work from the startup. Probably a few months of work if we want to fully integrate it. So no matter how great I think the idea is, it is probably not a feasible or worthwhile one to integrate.<br />
:::::::Now [[User:Hawk|Hawk]], you seem to be interested in the same thing that I am (and in fact something I have been working on). You want some sort of form based generator that will automatically format the pages after you supply some information. I have almost finished an NPC Generator, which should be promising. I just need to add in spellcasting, epic spellcasting, and special abilities. Forms can always be done directly in php and linked to. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 07:14, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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::::::::This forms extension allows you to not only create a page but edit it using the forms as far as I can tell. I do not know if your PHP pages can do that but if they do it creates a slight issue on the off chance that someone is editing the page on the wiki and on the form the wiki edit would be wiped over when you save the form as it is working directly with the database (I assume). Where as using this forms extension your still working within the wiki and it will prompt you like normal that there is a conflict (yet again I assume) and the situation can be remedied. I do not know exactly what semantic wiki does but the benefits of the forms extension as I understand them are:<br />
::::::::* Creation and editing of pages through forms<br />
::::::::* Users can create their own forms 'easily'<br />
::::::::* Those new to wiki's can use these forms and the page will be automatically wikified which means very little formating will be required afterwards.<br />
::::::::* The fact your filling in a form rather than code means that it's less daunting for the new user and they are more likly to contribute.<br />
::::::::* Organization of Dnd Wiki can easily be improved as categories can be added automatically to entries by use of the forms.<br />
::::::::[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 08:01, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::What I have been working is only for initial creation, though at some point I would like to have an "import feature". If we had it all form based, however, people would not learn wiki syntax, which is a powerful syntax in its own right. Is that a bad thing? I'm really not sure. Templates can also automatically add categories though.<br />
:::::::::I still don't understand exactly how a wiki works on the back end, and I am actually going to toy with Media Wiki and Semantic Wiki (with the forms extension) tonight. I will see if I can integrate an application with the wiki directly, while still preserving the wiki ways (as an edit not an overwrite). I will also see how easy it is to create a semantic wiki form. Not that my input is even close to the be-all and end-all of this discussion, but I would like to share what I learn with the community. I hope that Semantic Wiki is very easy to use and the forms feature is as well. Good call making note of it! --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 10:28, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::Personally I love coding I'm a nerd I admit it lol, but what it keeps coming down to for me is not everyone does and allowing those people to add and edit their creations on here would be awesome. And the forms extension seems to be the quickest, easiest and most effective way of doing that. Let me know how you go with the testing it will be interesting to see if it performs as well as I am hoping. [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 10:36, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::Did you end up trying this out Aarnott? [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 21:09, 21 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::::Short answer: yes. Long answer: I think I messed up on the install because I'm getting some strange errors thrown during runtime (like when I access the localhost server). I'm going to uninstall everything today and retry it (no work or school today -- yay!). Third time is a charm ''':)'''. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 08:37, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::::So it ended up being an easy thing to install and I was just being dumb ''':P'''. I have got a few form examples working and I think it is a really sweet extension, but there is a major problem that really limits the Semantic Form usage. The form must be used to fill a template (at least from my knowledge using their built-in form generator). This poses a problem if we wanted to have users fill in a race page for example. They could only fill out the author template and x0 template (or Race template if we replace that), but the point stands that there are limitations. Semantic Wiki on its own though looks like a really great extension and the forms extension would be good to use at least for some pages. All the work I have done with races, for example, can be made a lot better by tagging particular parts of an article. If we can get the form extension working in the ideal way, then new users will never create a poorly formatted page. I say go for the installs. They definitely don't hurt and in fact I will start a project to tag all the races so we can get rid of templates to store information. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 11:30, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
{{Discussion Indentation Revert}}<br />
<br />
:Okay, we can give it a go. I will have [[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] install it when he answers me back. Also, I am a little confused as to what you are saying above. Can we or can we not get rid of the [[Template:x0]] on the races' pages with this extension? I thought this made it so one can "tag" certain parts of an article and have those "tags" show up on a different page as well (like a split [[Template:x0]] (just like [[DnD Deities|Deities]] is currently organized)). --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 11:38, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::We can get rid of any templates we use that duplicate information already in the article (such as x0). What happens is we create properties which are used to identify information. So in the case of a Race, we would have a property called "Ability Score Adjustments" or something like that and tag the section directly in the article that refers to the ability score adjustments. Instead of using dpl to grab template information, we use semantic wiki to grab the "Ability Score Adjustment" directly from the page. The main advantage in my opinion is that when you update a page, you only have to change information once and then the tables update. It will be some work though (thus why it would become a project for me), but Semantic Wiki does not change existing wiki functionality, which is a very good thing. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 11:45, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::I installed WAMP (appache server + php + mysql latest stable versions) on my vista ultimate machine last night and then installed media wiki semantic and the forms extension I had no trouble it installed perfectly (apart from me stupidly trying to instal semantic forms with a mysql user that didn't have permission to create tables). I have been fiddling around a little havnt had much time though. Here's what i've figured out:<br />
:::# You create properties like string, page or date first<br />
:::# Then create templates (using the template making tool that comes with the forms) I made a author template and a very quick deity template.<br />
:::# then you make a form. You pick Author click add. then you click deity and click add (you can create forms which use more than one template!)<br />
:::# name the form then save<br />
:::# when you go to the form it will ask for a page name type one in like "MyDeity (DnD Deity)" hit enter<br />
:::# you are then taken to the form you fill it out it makes the page as per the templates it works as described !!! :O<br />
:::# you can even edit the page again using the form !!!<br />
::: [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 19:11, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
::::There is one thing though semantic wiki adds a box at the bottom of the page "Facts about..." if it can be removed i'd be happier. [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 19:16, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
:::::I just realized it would be relatively easy to turn our current preloads into templates add a few bits of code you have a compatible template to make a form for and if you edit the template EVERY SINGLE CREATURE, DEITY OR CLASS (that uses that template) IS EDITED AS WELL!!! meaning we decide we want the classes to look like (insert format here) we can instantly change them all at once!!! [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 19:36, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::The problem lies in the fact that we will have to change every single homebrew page. I'm up for the challenge (as long as it takes), but help will be nice if you are willing ''':)'''. It does seem pretty nifty though. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 20:20, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::I do not want this extension if the "Facts about" (or whatever it is called) is present. Is there a way to remove it? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:07, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::I am more than happy to help. What we need is to create the forms and templates so that all new entries use them. then start changing things over slowly, On the plus side if it takes awhile to convert the old stuff its not so bad as they will look exactly as they do now until we get to them. Perhaps we should consider moving this discussion onto it's own page before this page gets so large it destroys the Internet. I would also suggest holding off on installing it until we've fiddled some more to see what effect it has on the wiki like the damn facts about table. [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 22:10, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::I should point out the facts about table is only present on pages that use semantic data so if we did instal it it wouldnt effect anything until we started to make pages with semantic data on them. [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 22:14, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::This is an image of an author table I created useing a form [http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/6099/66402195ri6.jpg]<br />
::::::::::Notice it looks exactly the same as our current author table. Below is the form:<br />
::::::::::[http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/5454/36613376en2.jpg] [http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/766/83147904gr7.jpg] <br />
::::::::::Notice on the form the date field it is contextual so all dates on author pages will have the same format so yet more consistency [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 23:03, 22 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::First off, what is that operating system your using... please don't say Vista ''';)'''; Ubuntu überalles. Anyway, again, is there anyway to remove the "facts about" box? If that can be removed this will be installed right away. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 21:47, 24 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::::I'm afraid so I use (and like) Windows Vista Ultimate Version 6.0.6000 Build 6000. Ok I have figured out how to get rid of the factbox (that's its official name) you need to edit "SMW_Settings.php" in the folder "[wiki folder]\extensions\SemanticMediaWiki\includes". this line "$smwgShowFactbox = SMW_FACTBOX_NONEMPTY;" needs to be changed to "$smwgShowFactbox = SMW_FACTBOX_HIDDEN;" and this line "$smwgShowFactboxEdit = SMW_FACTBOX_NONEMPTY;" needs to be changed to "$smwgShowFactboxEdit = SMW_FACTBOX_HIDDEN;". Pages that were created with semantic data on them before you change these lines seem to keep the factbox for some reason on my machine so those settings should be changed as soon as the extension is installed. [[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 23:35, 24 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::::I've put my project of wikifying entries on hold until we figure all this out because if we decide to edit the old entries so they use the forms templates I'll be doubling up on work. If we make semantic templates out of the preloads the articles made with forms will look like our current entries but if we want the old entries to get layout updates automatically like the new entries will be able to we will have to change all the old entries. As [[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] says it will be a mammoth task but in the end I think the benefits are worth it. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 23:45, 26 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
{{Discussion Indentation Revert}}<br />
<br />
:Is there an ETA for Blue Dragon to put this on the server? I'm eager to work on using the Semantic features! --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 12:36, 27 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::It should be done now! ''':)''' &mdash; <span style="color:#002137;">[[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] <small> ([[User_talk:Blue Dragon|talk]])</small></span> 22:45, 28 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::I say lets start with [[LA 8 Races]]. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 23:22, 28 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::Okay, so [[Form:DnD Equipment]] was created, however the category issue and the identifier issue still needs to be solved. Any ideas on how to fix these problems? Also, I feel this would be a lot easier if two edit boxes worked on a form, however it seems they do not. Any ideas on how to circumvent this, or can two of them work on a form somehow? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 01:16, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::: Sorry GD but I don't have a clue what your asking. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 05:39, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::[[Form:DnD Equipment]] now includes categories, I do not know all the categories for subtype ie: outfits armor etc and the way i've written it you can only have one type category and one subtype category if someone wants to find a way around that be my guest and could someone who knows all the categories add a list to [[Property:Item Subtype]] for me the list should be written like [[Property:Item Type]]. I made some properties for the author template so we could use the new semantic search functionality to search for say all pages with me as the author but the template wasn't working properly after I added them so I reverted the edit I'll try to get it to work later but if someone else wants to try be my guest. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 07:04, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::P.S. Sorry about littering the recent changes pages with all those edits its hard to tell what an edit will do when your working on a template and form at the same time and changes to a form cant be seen through the preview button (because you only see the page title input box). also feel free to delete the page entitled test. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 07:09, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::P.P.S. I have added code to Category:Equipment so that any page using that category will have a tab at the top "Edit with form" which will send you to the equipment form. This will allow novices to edit their page without having to edit code and will allow us to edit the old pages so they use the form now. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 07:34, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::I have deleted the "Edit with Form" option &mdash; I want people to learn wiki syntax. Blue Dragon also implemented this, however I am not a fan. Deleted. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:55, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::Are you sure you want to enforce that? The whole purpose of wiki-markup is so that users don't have to know HTML to created and edit pages. Semantic Forms takes it one step further by narrowing the amount of wiki-markup a user has to use. It seems a bit counter-intuitive to actively require users to learn the wiki syntax. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 11:23, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::::This "edit with form" thing might help improve the formatting of pages made by new or non-users. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 11:55, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
{{Discussion Indentation Revert}}<br />
<br />
:Damn you [[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ''';)''', you're very right. Okay, I guess we can have them... It's just that I do not want a generation of users not learning wiki syntax; that could be detrimental to D&D Wiki. However, what is the goal of D&D Wiki? It's to provide a place where users can submit homebrew content so it can be played in other D&D campaigns. Editing with forms will just help make the goal of posting things and fixing things on D&D Wiki easier. I guess we should have it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:29, 29 February 2008 (MST) <br />
<br />
::For me it's more about letting people add and edit content easily without having to learn the entire wiki syntax in one hit. If they want their creations to look good they still have to learn syntax for stuff like equipment as there is no standard format for the item description etc so at current we just have an input box, but if they don't bother with syntax as a lot of creation i've wikified didn't then the form has done most of the wikifying for us. Does that mean I can put the edit with form tab back up? --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 19:04, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::I say go for it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:26, 2 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
=== SMW and DPL ===<br />
<br />
There's been a request for [http://semeb.com/dpldemo/index.php?title=Main_Page DPL] to be able to access SMW properties. I'm keeping an eye out for when this gets implemented. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 11:19, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:Once the semantic data is implemented it would be possible to replace the dpl generated tables with inline queries, if anyone is interested in doing that we would not need the DPL to be able to access SMW. I'm not sure how the DPL works exactly but SMW inline queries are done each time someone looks at a page so if the DPL doesn't do this using SMW inline queries may put more strin on the server for more information goto the SMW [http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Inline_queries manual] --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 18:59, 29 February 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::I'll have to play around with it and see the level of flexibility compared to DPL. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 04:35, 1 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::Had trouble using the queries on my test wiki but I suspect that may be because i'm not as smart as I like to think. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 06:10, 1 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::I made a query at [[LA 8 Races]], but I am getting SRD Matches for some reason. I think it is using an implicit OR rather than an implicit AND for the category matches, even though the documentation claims it uses AND by default. I do know a way to fix the table, but it is not elegant because it will stop working if we add semantic syntax to the SRD. I'll keep looking for an answer... --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 07:30, 1 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
== Featured Articles ==<br />
<br />
Hi everyone time for major change to the wiki idea number two (number one being semantic forms). I guess it's not a major change so much as a new 'thing'. I was wondering what would everyone think about having a article featured on the main page say every month. We nominate articles for featuring, people would support or oppose the articles then first day of the month one could be chosen to be on the main page until the next month. The articles would be finished work, well formated etc etc. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 06:23, 3 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:We could also go that step further and have a Process closer to wikipedias where you nominate an article it becomes 'featured' but does not necessarily get added to the main page. each month or week or whatever someone decides which one gets put up / you can request a featured article be considered for the main page. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 06:40, 3 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::Er... I know why you brought this up; it really is a standard across most wiki's. Therefore it makes me lean towards implementing it... Anyway, if this is to get implemented I do not want an obtrusive template, like the one on Uncyclopedia. Any thoughts for a good template? P.S. I like the second implementation more. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:37, 3 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::{| style="text-align: right; width: 100%; border: none;" <br />
| This is a [[Featured Articles|Featured Article]]! [[Image:Cscr-featured.png|30px]]<br />
|}<br />
:::Thoughts?<br />
:::--[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 14:33, 3 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::How do you handle projects? Does LotR count as one or a few hundred? Does the ''title page'' of LotR count? --[[User:Pwsnafu|Pwsnafu]] 17:38, 3 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::The main reason I was thinking about it is it puts some of our best work on the front page which draws in visitors instead of going through all those links to find something cool it's right there you can read it then people are more likely to go searching for more. It's also a recognition of your hard work having it on the main page. I like your little Featured article template is it for the talk page or the actual page if it's for the actual page perhaps it could be centered that way it blends in more being between the table of contents and the author template. We'd need some guidelines or criteria for making a page featured, and some one to arbitrate the process (and make final decisions) we can call him/her the Article Master or AM (like DM lol). we need to get some ideas rolling then maybe take a vote? --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 19:06, 3 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::Pwsnafu: I'd say for something like that it would be best to feature the main page of a project, not all subpages would need to be as good but there would still be a standard of quality for the entire project. Conversely a particularly good subpage which can stand on it's own could also be featured. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 19:10, 3 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::I've just been stareing at the main page for awhile and so far I haven't thought of much in the way of how we could format it. About the only thing I can think of would be move the tavern schedule down next to the news and then use that blank space next to the menu for the featured articles. EDIT: personally I'd be for moving the tavern schedule to its own page. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 19:29, 3 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::[[Featured Articles]] --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 01:42, 4 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::I'm all for it, if it means that even wanton visitors can get a more inside view of the site at first glance. It might persuade some of them to stick around and lord knows dandwiki can use more contributors :O. --[[User:Sulacu|Sulacu]] 10:01, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::::::::Yes! --[[User:Penske|Penske]] 15:27, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::::::::Now we just need some featured articles :P. Hard to judge the true value of a system if it isn't used. --[[User:Sulacu|Sulacu]] 18:29, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
== Gygax Gone at 69 ==<br />
<br />
[[:Category:Gary Gygax|Gary Gygax]], co-creator of D&D with [[:Category:Dave Arneson|Dave Arneson]], passed away Tuesday, March 4th, 2008, at the age of 69. Read coverage on it at [http://blog.wired.com/underwire/2008/03/report-gary-gyg.html Wired], [http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/technology/2008/03/farewell_gary_gygax_the_dungeo.html BBC News], [http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080304/ap_en_ot/obit_gygax Yahoo! News], [http://games.slashdot.org/article.pl?no_d2=1&sid=08/03/04/1750206 /.], and many other news sites. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 09:18, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:[[Discussion:The Passing of a Giant - RIP Gary Gygax]] --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 09:21, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
== Submitted for Your Approval ==<br />
<br />
I present the new [[Form:DnD Spell|form for submitting (non-epic) spells]], Courtesy of Semantic MediaWiki and Semantic Forms. [[Special:EditData/Form:DnD_Spell/User:Sledged/Atonement|Here]]'s what it looks like with the fields populated. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 15:30, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:Hm... I wish you could make it work more like [[Form:Rating]] where it uses a template which, once saved, goes to the normal wiki formatting. Can this be done with spells as well? It's just that I do not really want the formatting of all the spells changed to this new "standard". --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:18, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::If that is what is wanted all you have to do is add <tt><nowiki>subst:</nowiki></tt> in the form code next to any templates you want to be substituted onto the page. --[[User:Hawk|Hawk]] 20:33, 5 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::Just be aware that if <tt>subst:</tt> is added, you'll lose the option of using the form to edit the page once it's been created. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 11:21, 6 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
::::It is a price I would be willing to pay. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 13:44, 6 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
:::::Okay, there's a problem with <tt>subst:</tt>. Part of the way to form works is that it looks at the template to see what properties it has and which parameters are associated with each property. When you use <tt>subst:</tt>, it's looking for the page <tt>Template:subst:template name</tt> instead of <tt>Template:template name</tt> and it makes the form useless as a result. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 14:37, 6 March 2008 (MST)<br />
<br />
== Wiki Criticism ==<br />
<br />
This is the most useless Wiki I have ever found on D&D. I'm sick of homebrew rubbish. I'm trying to find info on Mask and Olidamarra (spelling?) and I can't find anything good) {{unsigned| 68.193.215.240}}<br />
<br />
:Admittedly, this probably isn't the best wiki to go to for official WotC material, but that doesn't make it useless. What's wrong with homebrew? WotC seems to encourage it, and the only real difference between good homebrew and published material is that the former is sold in books. --[[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]] 05:40, 14 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::We are not allowed to have information about Gods and Goddesses on D&D Wiki. They are reserved as product identity. Sorry about that. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 21:27, 14 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Should be in [[Deities and Demigods]], no? If you want even more information than that, you're likely looking into some very specific Forgotten Realms books. --[[User:Sulacu|Sulacu]] 18:51, 20 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::Boy, I thought I was pushy and opinionated. This site rocks for people like us who want to post and discuss shit. What else could you want? So you want Wizards information? So what! They want your money! Give them money or shut up and start writing. That's just my opinion of this issue.<br />
<br />
:::: :P ;) -- [[User:Xidoraven|xido]] 15:07, 23 June 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== WotC Website Material ==<br />
<br />
It occurred to me as I was answering a question about what material we have on the site...would we be able to host material from the wizards site? [http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/arch/psi The Mind's Eye], for instance, has some interesting things, and I would love to see things like it on the wiki. --[[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]] 19:16, 18 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Hm... Can we http://ww2.wizards.com/Company/Default.aspx?doc=SiteLegalNotice? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 14:19, 19 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::According to section 2, "You are granted a limited, non-sublicenseable license to ''access'' and use the Site and ''electronically copy'' (except where specified as prohibited) and ''print to hard copy portions'' of Site Content for your ''personal'', noncommercial use only; provided, that you preserve any copyright, trademark or other similar notices contained in or associated with such Site Content. Such license is subject to these TOU and does not include: [...] (ii) the collection and use of any product or service listings, pictures or descriptions; '''(iii) the distribution (electronic or otherwise), public performance, or public display of any Site Content;''' [...] downloading (other than the page caching) of any portion of the Site, any Site Content or any information contained therein, except as expressly permitted on the Site; [...]"<br />
::In other words, I think not. Hosting anything more than links here violates the spirit of the first, italicized part (my emphasis) and also several of the explicit prohibitions (especially the bolded one, also my emphasis added). So... probably not. And WotC has a history of taking a very hard line against IP infringement, copyright suits, etc. &mdash;[[User:EldritchNumen|EldritchNumen]] 14:33, 19 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Well once you sift through a little legal phrasing, that's pretty clear...their terms of use explicitly forbid it, since a wiki definately counts as public display. Oh well ''':/'''. --[[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]] 16:50, 19 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::The shame is that this material will disappear. When I was documenting Wizard's past products, I found that many items had dropped off their site. They are poor caretakers of their own material. The academic in me want to preserve their own web content for their own good.--[[User:Dmilewski|Dmilewski]] 18:10, 19 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
==Feats==<br />
<br />
How about an area under the Featured Article for a 'Feat of the Day' with a link to a feat... --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 19:14, 19 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:If you go that route, you can just as well try to implement such a component feature for other groupings of data. Spell of the Day, NPC of the Day, etc. --[[User:Sulacu|Sulacu]] 18:54, 20 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::I agree, no such special section for feats is necessary, they can become featured as well ''';)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 00:44, 21 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Link of the day? kinda like a word of the day feature... --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 08:10, 7 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Other Netbooks ==<br />
<br />
Does anyone know where to find the other netbooks from FanCC? I'd be interested in seeing them, possibly up on the wiki. {{Unsigned|Gruegirl|22:00, 23 April 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
:I am not sure, sorry. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:12, 29 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== 4th Edition Link ==<br />
<br />
I've had a thought; I think we could, and probably should, put the link to the 4th edition homebrew (and possibly the SRD, though we can't put it up yet, for obvious reasons) on the main page, because, as people in ENworld have proved, we have enough preveiw material from the PHB Lite (derived from the pregenerated characters and rogue preview) to make some powers, the 1st level for classes, and odd things here-and-there. As ENworld is already doing odd bits of 4e homebrew based on previews, we might as well provide a place for it to go now, rather than later.<br />
<br />
Also, my gaming group has started a 4e campaign with the Pre-Generated characters, and everything is ''so'' much more better than 3.5. The fighter felt more like a fighter than in 3.5. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 12:26, 26 April 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Although as the deadline is drawing nearer and nearer I am leaning towards using the same revised 3e pages and just changing the identifier/creating a namespace for them. The voting (please see above discussion) outlined that the community would prefer that we distinguish 4e from 3.5e with just namespaces and categories. I know you have spent a lot of time on the 4e pages, however do we really need them? Is there any way we could utilize the current pages with 4e? Thoughts? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 00:16, 5 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Won't be playing 4e for quite a while. Checkbook ain't so hot right now. So I would personally prefer keeping a 3e section and a seperate 4e section. --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 08:13, 7 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::I don't think it would be possible anyway. I think it would be easier and less confusing to keep them seperate... --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 08:23, 7 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::I have had a look over the [[4e Homebrew]] page and checked it, and I think it is as ready as it can be before 4e comes out; we just need a preload for classes and dragons and we're fine (not enough info right now!); so as it's two weeks this friday I feel that we should put up the link for the 4th edition homebrew (but not the SRD!) ''now'' for the reasons I stated above. I don't think that we could combine the 3e and 4e sections, and I feel that it would be easier to use if they where seperate. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 11:57, 21 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::Looks good, thanks for doing that. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 18:25, 22 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Random Link ==<br />
<br />
Would it be possible to add a random link to the navigation links too the side? This will allow for a more rounded out site over all. Eg. people are able to fix and contribute to content that they may not normally get to see. This will also allow DM's to make more interesting characters. --[[User:Sabre070|Sabre070]] 00:21, 6 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:I like the idea of a random page link too. Course there is one in the special pages link on the side and you could add one to your user page (as I have). --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 08:09, 7 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
==Featured User==<br />
How about a link to a particularly good user page. There are a few out there and it may encouraage others to create pages of their own. Maybe have a pool of good user pages that the link is randomly derived from. --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 08:07, 7 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:I vote no. --[[User:Othtim|Othtim]] 17:56, 16 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Any particular reason? --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 19:25, 16 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Perhaps because it could be taken as a glorification of the user chosen. [[User:OptimizationFanatic|OptimizationFanatic]] 19:54, 16 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::A little recognition isn't a bad thing. It would also be a way for newcomers to see what they can do for their user page. --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 20:41, 16 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::I am against it because it would further clutter the [[Main Page]] and I do not feel it would be used as much as, say, the FA link. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 22:21, 16 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::: I'm just imagining how it'd work:<br />
::::::: ''Sledged is a wiki admin who likes templates, optimizations, and long walks on the beach. Come visit his user page.''<br />
:::::: Gives me a little chuckle. —[[User:Sledged|Sledged]] ([[User talk:Sledged|talk]]) 22:28, 16 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::Ooh, I like long walks too... --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 17:38, 17 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
==Search Function Broken== <br />
Most searches return no pages; even a search as simple as "magic" gives an "nothing found" screen. [[User:Noname|Noname]] 21:13, 20 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Not that big of a problem... just search externally and it works fine. Just click a few extra times and your done. Nice to have it working again, but until then let's not make a huge deal of it. [[User:Palantini|Palantini]] 20:52, 21 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== 4e SRD ==<br />
<br />
There is some news about the 4e SRD [http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/4news/20080606a here]. --[[User:Sam Kay|Sam Kay]] 03:03, 7 June 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== WYSIWYG extension ==<br />
<br />
I was thinking about how we want our users to have an easier time to post homebrew content. Then I realized that I spend a lot of time formatting tables and such. With a lot of website installations I do, I use Joomla, which comes with a built-in WYSIWYG editor. Well I did some research and apparently there is a good one for mediawiki. Take a look at [http://mediawiki.fckeditor.net/ http://mediawiki.fckeditor.net/]. I think this would be a sweet component to install -- for both new and experienced users. If there is a way to configure on your user profiler which editor to use, that would be even better (I'm not sure about that yet). --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 10:34, 20 June 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== ENWiki ==<br />
<br />
FYI. ENworld has opened a wiki. http://www.enworld.org/articles/EN_Wiki_Is_Open_For_Entries!/6718 {{Unsigned|Dmilewski|07:23, 7 July 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
:It seems like D&D Wiki and ENworld Wiki have the same goals in common... I guess I just hope it dies out then, and luckily right now D&D Wiki is far superior. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:22, 7 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:: Death to Enworld! Long live D&D Wiki! Really I also hope their life will be short, after all we are far older.--[[User:Lord Dhazriel|Lord Dhazriel]] 16:24, 7 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::One big problem is that they continue to garner support from people on the WotC D&D Forums. That is getting them to publish their Homebrew stuff on their site, while I find most users there do not even know we exist. It might be smart to more actively promote our Wiki among the Homebrewers there and try to solicate their content. Also ENworld seems to be pickier about submissions being completed within a timely fashion, and that they are grammatically correct with proper spelling. This may be something we should pay closer attention to; eliminating entries that have sat uncompleted for months on end, or ones that are painful to read because of grammer and/or spelling. -- [[User:Sepsis|Sepsis]] 15:42, 15 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
==Featured Articles==<br />
Yipes...I've heard it mentioned elsewhere but there really needs to be a schedule for changing out the '''Featured Article'''. The current one has been up for 7 or 8 months, and I know there are 11 current nominees. Perhaps the nominees need to be better presented so members can vote on them without it seeming like they must hunt to find them. -- [[User:Sepsis|Sepsis]] 11:28, 9 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Tamriel and Elder scrolls: oblivion ==<br />
<br />
The Campaign settings involving the elder scrolls universe should all be merged together this includes those discussing: Nirn Tamriel and the elder scrolls IV: Oblivion, the nine divines, daedra and aedra, the tribunal temple saints etc.. it is kind of pointless that we seperate and break all of these up<br />
<br />
<br />
--[[User:Moon Sugar Vehk|Moon Sugar Vehk]] 10:06, 27 October 2008 (MDT)</div>Moon Sugar Vehkhttps://www.dandwiki.com/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Green_Dragon&diff=289042User talk:Green Dragon2008-10-27T14:57:12Z<p>Moon Sugar Vehk: New section: one more question serjo</p>
<hr />
<div>{{:User:Green Dragon/Top Template}}<br />
{{Messages of Interest|messages=<br />
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|section=Talk:Bodily Relics?<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
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|notifier=Lord Dhazriel<br />
|date_time=05:51, 6 May 2008 (MDT)<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
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|notifier=Hawk<br />
|date_time=07:23, 28 March 2008 (MDT)<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Regiment_(DnD_Template)<br />
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|date_time=16:58, 17 March 2008 (MDT)<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:DnD_Equipment<br />
|section=Cost and Weight<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Catgirl/Nekomusume/Nekomimi_(DnD_Race)<br />
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|date_time=16:28, 26 February 2008 (MST)<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Brawling_(DnD_Variant_Rule)<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Marksman_(DnD_Class)<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:User_Base_Classes<br />
|section=<br />
|notifier=Sledged<br />
|date_time=14:27, 19 February 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Vest_of_the_Bold_(DnD_Equipment)<br />
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|notifier=Cronocke<br />
|date_time=05:17, 18 February 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Pedistal_of_Truth_(DnD_Equipment)<br />
|section=Format Format<br />
|notifier=Green Dragon<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Performer_(DnD_Prestige_Class)<br />
|section=<br />
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|date_time=18:22, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
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|notifier=Sam Kay<br />
|date_time=07:20, 5 February 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Paladin_Mount_from_first_level_(DnD_Variant_Rule)<br />
|section=<br />
|notifier=Sam Kay<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
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|date_time=17:54, 31 January 2008 (MST)<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:DnD_Maps<br />
|section=Maybe this should be in environments after all?<br />
|notifier=EldritchNumen<br />
|date_time=12:32, 3 January 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Chromatic_Dwarf_(DnD_Creature)<br />
|section=Race<br />
|notifier=Green Dragon<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Combat_School_(DnD_Variant_Rules)<br />
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|date_time=23:57, 21 May 2007 (MDT)<br />
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{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=MediaWiki:Sharedupload<br />
|section=<br />
|notifier=Green Dragon<br />
|date_time=23:01, 14 May 2007 (MDT)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=dndmedia:D&D_Wiki_Media_talk:Copyrights<br />
|section=Image documentation<br />
|notifier=Cuthalion<br />
|date_time=14:11, 11 May 2007 (MDT)<br />
}}<br />
}}<br />
<br />
<br />
{{Archives<br />
|label1= Archive 1 (Discussions 1 &ndash; 30)<br />
|label2= Archive 2 (Discussions 31 &ndash; 60)<br />
|label3= Archive 3 (Discussions 61 &ndash; 90)<br />
|label4= Archive 4 (Discussions 91 &ndash; 120)<br />
|label5= Archive 5 (Discussions 121 &ndash; 150)<br />
|label6= Archive 6 (Discussions 151 &ndash; 180)<br />
|label7= Archive 7 (Discussions 181 &ndash; 210)<br />
|label8= Archive 8 (Discussions 211 &ndash; 240)<br />
|label9= Archive 9 (Discussions 241 &ndash; 270)<br />
|label10= Archive 10 (Discussions 271 &ndash; 300)<br />
|label11= Archive 11 (Discussions 301 &ndash; 330)<br />
}}<br />
<br />
== Recent Changes ==<br />
<br />
Is it possible to have a recent changes for articles in a catergory? --[[User:Sabre070|Sabre070]] 09:36, 9 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Yes. See an example below:<br />
:<nowiki><dpl></nowiki><br />
:category=Race<br />
:ordermethod=firstedit<br />
:count=10<br />
:order=descending<br />
:notnamespace=Category<br />
:<nowiki></dpl></nowiki><br />
<br />
:Hope that helps! --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 10:37, 9 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Additionally you can always use <tt><nowiki>[{{SERVER}}{{localurl:Special:Recentchangeslinked/Category:______}} RC for ______]</nowiki></tt> (feel free to test it out in the [[Sandbox]]). Hope this helps as well. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:54, 9 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== How Do I Add a New Page To My Userpage? ==<br />
<br />
I need to know for one of my projects --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 04:30, 16 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
: You can make a link to pages using this: <nowiki>[[Page name|Show text]]</nowiki>. This will allow you to make a new page or link to a pre-existing page. You also have to options to make new pages via the "preloads", the "Add new (something)" links. Hope this helps.. :) --[[User:Sabre070|Sabre070]] 06:03, 16 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::i meant so the title would be like User:Jack Bread/(name) something like that --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 21:27, 18 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Here's how i do it - just type what you want to name the page in the search box ("User:Jack Bread/MainPage" as an example) and then click go. It will bring up the page you type in. After that you can just edit the page and you're good to go. Hope I was helpful :) --[[User:EaTCarbS|EaTCarbS]] 03:58, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::I agree, the "Search" method is best. Additionally you can always edit the sandbox, type in your page name, then click the red link. Hope this helps as well. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:55, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::Thanks! --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 17:38, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::No problem, glad to help. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 17:39, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== 4e Powers ==<br />
<br />
There seem to be a few formatting errors on the pages for the SRD 4e Powers. I suggest taking a look at them so you can determine exactly what you need to do, but the main one I've noticed happened to be one of the lines missing the category= line. This has resulted in those pages not displaying any of the information they should. --[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 09:21, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:I am a little confused. First off no SRD 4e powers are present on D&D Wiki as the SRD has yet to be freely released for 4e. Also, <tt>category=</tt> needs to be present in dpl's as it will not work without it. This defines the parameter. If you could supply a link to the page you are curious about I would be very appreciated. Thanks. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:54, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::It happens to be [[4e Powers|this page]] and pages similar to [[4e_Martial_Powers|this page.]] The pages like 4e Martial Powers are supposed to be for homebrewed powers for already existing power sources, or for already existing classes, right? Well, the problem is when you view the pages, nothing appears. This is because the line that should say category=Level 1 Powers, or some other level, lacks the category= at the beginning of the line. Sorry if my original explanation confused you.--[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 17:45, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::You are completely right, they are lacking the category= in front of the categories. Feel free to fix this for all the 4e pages! Thanks in advance! --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 17:51, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::Lol, I would, but they're all protected. Forgetting not everyone is an admin?--[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 17:57, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::There we go &mdash; changed them to only be locked to IP eidts. That's how they were supposed to be all along. Sorry about that. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 18:03, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::Oh, lord. Somebody needs to lay off the booze when they make these big pages... Categorical mistakes everywhere. There is no Power category, but there is a 4e Power category. No Arcane category but there is a 4e Arcane Power category. All over everything...--[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 18:12, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::I can only agree, strange mistakes and strange things like this are all over the 4e homebrew areas. ''Please'' feel free to standardize things &mdash; it truly would be a huge help. If you are really interested in helping out the 4e homebrew section [[Talk:4e Homebrew#Quality Control]] may interest you. Please feel free to help, it needs it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 18:14, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Quick Question From A New Guy On Article Deletion ==<br />
<br />
Hi, I recently posted a short article on the campaign setting I made for my tabletop game (Four Worlds, was the name). I was planning on updating it every few days with more information, but today I see it was deleted. It might just be because I'm not used to the way these articles work yet, but I couldn't find any description of why it was deleted. I'm just wondering why it was and if I should write up a more substantial portion before creating it. Thanks. --[[User:Windandfire|windandfire]] 23:29, 24 July 2008 (MDT)Windandfire<br />
<br />
:I have restored [[Four Worlds (DnD Campaign Setting)]]. I deleted it because it seemed very sparse in information and I thought it was not going to be worked on. Sorry about that, and I have restored it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:58, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::That's ok. I'll be trying to add to it every weekday, so it should grow quickly. Thanks for restoring it. --[[User:Windandfire|windandfire]] 12:51, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::No problem, sorry about deleting it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 17:32, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Tavern Spammer ==<br />
<br />
IP # I69_119_7_80 was spamming in the tavern and being outright annoying, I cant do anything, so i figured I'd let you know, if anything can be done, that would be great, thank you, [[User:Summerscythe|Summerscythe]] 13:59, 26 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Currently banning individuals from editing does nothing to their tavern usage... I'm terribly sorry about this. I have asked [[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] to change this numerous times, he just has not got around to fixing this problem yet. Is this still a problem? If so i'll talk to him more forcibly about this problem ''';)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:23, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== THE ULTIMATE BAG OF BEANS!! '''>:D''' ==<br />
<br />
I wanted to know if I could put an 2nd edition magic item on the site and convert it to 3.5. --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 15:05, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:If you made the item, feel free. If it was published it is okay if it's OGC. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:20, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::It was homebrew, made by someone else, I can give you a link if you like --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 15:32, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::As long as you have their permission, please feel free to add it! --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:33, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Paragon Class Preload ==<br />
<br />
Would you mind changing the Paragon Class preload to use the [[template:4e Paragon Class Power]] instead of the tables that is currently does? And don't you dare tell me I should make it into a form.--[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 22:44, 2 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Soulbinder ==<br />
<br />
I believe the soulbinder finally meets the standards for featured article, if you want to look it over and tell me what you think that would be great. thanks[[User:Summerscythe|Summerscythe]] 11:10, 6 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
P.S. I dont want to sound pushy, I'm just really excited.<br />
<br />
== Lock Up Please ==<br />
<br />
[[Bag of Numerous Items (DnD Equipment)]] I would like it if you locked up this I don't want anyone messing with it (the sooner the better). {{Unsigned|Necrorock|05:09, 9 August 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
:I locked it. Let me know if you want me to unlock it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 12:54, 9 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== THANKS ==<br />
<br />
i think it was you who locked up my page so thanks even it it wasnt the page was bag of numerous items by necrorock<br />
<br />
== My Mask of It. ==<br />
<br />
I was wondering, do I have the price made correctly? If not, feel free to change it. Also, you rule for making this site. The URL of it is: http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Mask_of_IT_%28DnD_Equipment%29. And if there is anything else wrong, feel free to edit.<br />
<br />
== Problem with ritual ==<br />
<br />
Hi, in my ritual Raise (Create) Undead, i can't add the time and duration of it, don't know why?--[[User:dokuro|dokuro]]<br />
<br />
== Thanks for the greeting ==<br />
<br />
Thank's for the greeting, I apreciate it. I was kinda wondering the best way besides going into the tavern (witch i love) to get my prestige class rated or to get some kind of review of it... it is my first one and I am not sure how balanced it is as a class. Anyways Thanks again.<br />
--[[User:Fletcher123|Fletcher123]] 15:43, 20 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Tavern Moderators ==<br />
<br />
We really need some moderators in the Tavern, because every once in a while we get people in there who just spam and make it nearly impossible to chat. Today a little before 8:00 PM EST was a good example. Perhaps wiki admins could be turned into chat moderators as well, or perhaps have it be a separate status requiring a separate vote, or...something. Whatever the method, we need mods. --[[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]] 18:03, 20 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Double plus agreement. We have several regulars. Having one who can use that Kick function in chat would be just dandy. I might even refrain from partaking in your delicious flesh, Burger Dragon. I mean Green. Yes.<br />
:But yes, seriously, I fully support this request. -- [[User:Eiji|Eiji]] 14:42, 22 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Bump. For the love of god, please give at least one regular to the tavern mod powers. --[[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]] 18:10, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::I would vote [[User:Ganteka|Ganteka]], [[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]], and [[User:Eiji|Eiji]] at least since I see them in there a lot (and they are all mature enough not to abuse powers). --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 21:32, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== 3.x Conversions ==<br />
<br />
I have converted a few 3.x Monsters, that were not presented in the new MM, into 4e versions. Is it alright to post them on the Wiki? -- [[User:Sepsis|Sepsis]] 22:16, 26 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== petition to remove content ==<br />
<br />
hello :)<br />
<br />
i believe that my paragon class for the wizard is no good and would like it for you to take it off please! :)<br />
<br />
the reason for this is that i think that the aim of the paragon tier is not for such a big change on the base class.[[User:Dokuro|Dokuro]]<br />
<br />
== A Few Questions ==<br />
<br />
So this is Mander. About a year ago I got really involved with the wiki, and have since been less involved. I'm looking to be more involved again. I was wondering, is there a forum like section on this webpage where I could start a topic or two for discussion? Also I have more to add to this wiki, but I seem to be starting over on my wiki skills. In a sense I'm looking for a wiki mentor. I'm sure I had other questions, I'm just forgetting them right now. {{Unsigned|Mander|14:58, 6 September 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
:Hello Mander! Welcome back. If you have some questions feel free to ask them on [[DnD Discussion|Discussions]]. Also, I would be more than willing to take a look at your creations, and help you format them, once you have added them. Just give me a link once the page is created and I will see what can be improved. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 11:05, 30 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== My Additions ==<br />
<br />
I don't suppose you could check over the [[Elementalist (DnD Prestige Class)|Elementalist]] prestige class, and [[Arcane Leadership (DnD Feat)|Arcane Leadership]], [[Ascetic Leadership (DnD Feat)|Ascetic Leadership]], [[Divine Leadership (DnD Feat)|Divine Leadership]], [[Martial Leadership (DnD Feat)|Martial Leadership]] and [[Wild Leadership (DnD Feat)|Wild Leadership]] feats? The leadership feats were inspired by Undead Leadership from Libris Mortis, so they follow the same basic idea - is that okay OGL-wise? --[[User:Damuna|Damuna]] 19:18, 6 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:If you want to do the need changes yourself for practice, the feats need to have links put in them. --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 12:28, 7 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Namespace addition ==<br />
<br />
Hi Green_Dragon!<br />
<br />
I am currently in the process of splitting material like prestige classes out of four very long articles ([[Tome of Necromancy (DnD Other)]], [[Tome of Fiends (DnD Other)]], [[Dungeonomicon (DnD Other)]], [[Races of War (DnD Other)]]) into their own articles, for easier digestion and use/reference by people. Unfortunately, while doing so, I've run into a couple of namespace conflicts. I'm worried about more namespace conflicts and namespace pollution in the future; so I was wondering if instead of, say, (DnD Prestige Class) appended onto prestige classes, I could use something like (Tome Prestige Class) as people often call those four works "The Tomes".<br />
<br />
I am given to understand that there are scripts that automagically add prestige classes to the list of homebrew prestige classes when new prestige classes are made. I am also given to understand that this only works with the (DnD Prestige Class) namespace. Is my understanding correct? If I can use the new namespace, is it okay for me to edit those articles by hand to add the prestige classes in at the correct points? (Or could the scripts be extended to the Tome namespace, if such is allowed?)<br />
<br />
Thanks! [[User:Surgo|Surgo]] 18:36, 8 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Epic-only PrC Templates ==<br />
<br />
I noticed recently that there aren't preloads or categories for prestige classes with epic level requirements, as I'm have little skill at making them, I wondered if you might do the honors? Here's one that can be added: [[Thlatian Bladelord (DnD Prestige Class)]]. Thanks!-[[User:Risek|Risek]] 11:15, 10 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Modern's Future? ==<br />
<br />
I hope you are right one to ask, since the d20 Modern fellow is away.<br />
<br />
Well I have a rather serious question concerning d20 Modern and well…err let me get to the point.<br />
<br />
Since d20 Modern is out of print and majority of the material is hard to come by shouldn’t the rest of the material be placed in the Modern section. The reason for concern is that there’s is a good chance that Hasbro will try to completely kill-off Modern and well since I love Modern I was simply wondering whether the remaining material will be added or not.<br />
<br />
I mean, from what I can tell 2nd Edition players generally have the complete material for use online and so I thought that Modern should as well.<br />
<br />
Gah! hope I said what I meant to say.<br />
<br />
-Magus Black, the Oracle of Blades<br />
<br />
== Who do I ask to review a custom class I created? ==<br />
<br />
As the title states:<br />
Who do I ask to review a custom class I created?<br />
<br />
:Best bet is to put a link with the question and someone may take a look. Which class is it? --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 13:30, 3 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Foxphyre Page IP Lock ==<br />
<br />
I would like my page locked to IPs, and if possible set properly to have me as its creator, because I didn't register till a while after its creation. link follows [[Foxphyre (DnD Race)]]. {{Unsigned|Morbosa|17:01, 24 September 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
:Done. Let me know if that's what you had in mind. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:56, 30 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== A question about the scout's skirmish ability ==<br />
<br />
Hey it said if I had any question about d&d or anything to ask, well my current question is about the Scout's (3.5e Complete Adventurer) skirmish ability. In the ability description it says the scout gets to apply skirmish damage if they move at least 10 ft. Well me and my friends were wondering how this worked when the scout is mounted. Does the actually scout have to move 10 ft, or do they get skirmish damage if their mount moves 10 at least ft? Also if only the mount has to move, if only the mount has to move then this enables the scout to do a full attack with skirmish and our second question is would the scout get skirmish damage from ever attack?<br />
<br />
What are your thoughts on this?<br />
<br />
:I can answer these. Skirmish does not work with mounts (being displaced 10 ft. is different than physically moving 10 ft). You can get full attack + skirmish with a variety of tricks such as the Pounce ability (look at the complete champion barbarian variant), or the [[SRD:Psychic Warrior|Psychic Warrior]]'s ''[[SRD:Psionic Lion's Charge|Psionic Lion's Charge]]'' power. Skirmish applies to every attack much like sneak attack does. Take a look at the Improved Skirmish feat (also Complete adventurer I think) as well as Swift Ambusher (Complete Scoundrel). Improved Skirmish will add +2d6 damage if you move 20ft. Swift ambusher stacks ranger levels with scout levels for the purposes of skirmish. You can use this to have a high Base Attack Bonus and high skirmish (though the barbarian level will add an exp penalty unless you make the build very carefully).<br />
<br />
:Above all optimization, have fun playing a scout! They offer a lot of fun tactical decisions and they don't need to be optimized to do cool things. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 13:47, 6 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Featured Article ==<br />
<br />
I've been a member of this site for around 6 months, and for about 5 of those months, cassia has been the featured article. Now i have nothing against the article, cuz its a good article, but its been up for a long time, and there are about ten other candidates in line, all great articles. i believe a change should happen pretty soon. Your Friend, [[User:Summerscythe|Summerscythe]] 12:57, 6 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:I completely agree. The only issue is that the current FA Nominees may or may not meet the FA criteria. If you have some spare time please help format and/or review some of the FA Nominees so we can bring them up to the FA criteria. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 09:28, 7 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
==Epic home brew==<br />
So, I realize my combat Assassin is a little overpowered for a prestige class. Mainly just because i never meant for it to be prestige, but as an epic addition. Is there a way to have an Epic prestige area for home brew content? thanks --[[User:Cerin616|Cerin616, Drew]] 18:54, 6 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Quest/Campaign and Subpages ==<br />
<br />
Hey Green Dragon!<br />
<br />
Thanks for the welcome message.<br />
<br />
I am working on [[Soul of the Dragon Seer (3.5e Quest)|Soul of the Dragon Seer]] and I have a few questions. First, this is going to be a campaign, rather than one stand-alone quest. I therefore am trying to figure out how to organize it, since I don't see any pages like that in the quest section. Should it instead go in the "Campaign World" section? Should the adventures that make up this campaign go in subpages, or have their own pages? Should NPCs and items be in subpages?<br />
<br />
I am also curious if this sort of article is even something you want on the wiki. It is more extensive than a stand-alone quest, so I am not sure if another DM would be as likely to use it.<br />
<br />
Thanks for the help/advice! --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 16:20, 7 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Adding it as a Campaign Setting would be the correct method. Each area of the Campaign world should have it's own page. A good example of how a CS should be organized can be found on any of the CS's which are rated 5. Hope this helps. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 11:28, 8 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Eh, I'm still confused, because it sounds like you are talking about an article for the world itself, which I also plan to make. What I am talking about is a series of quests that make up an overall "campaign". Does that still go in the "Campaign ''Setting''" section, even though its not really a setting? Thanks again for the advice :) -[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 12:38, 8 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::I think Endhaven has something similar to what you are looking for. See: [[Adventures (Endhaven)]]. There isn't anything there yet, but that is the way I would organize things. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 12:11, 9 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::Ah, that makes sense. I'm wondering if there would still be a way to link it from the quest page, though, since folks could potentially set the adventure in some other setting. But from what I understand, the article has to have (3.5e Quest) in the title to show up on that page. Hmmm... --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 12:58, 9 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
::::EDIT: On closer examination, it looks like its based on categories. That is really neat. I'll try some reorganizing then. --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 13:03, 9 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Gmandark. sorry ==<br />
<br />
hi thanks for the wellcume. I tride to ad a new warlock ivocasho to the list i fond but i mest it up all tho i am shore i will be abal to fix it in time i wood be very happy if sume one cude fix it in the meen time as im nuw to this and need to lern more about (a)wot i did rong and (b)how to fix it and this mite tack a fow weeks or munths<br />
<br />
== Another Question ==<br />
<br />
Hey thanks for answering my question about Skirmish, now one of my players has another question....<br />
It says that an animal cannot have an intelligence of above 2, in fact the exact wording is "a creature with an intelligence greater than 2, is not an animal." And it says that magical beasts are like animals except that they can have an intelligence of 3 or higher. The question he poses, is what would happen if when his dire hawk animal companion gained 4 or 8 hit dice, if he could increase its Int to 3. Is this possible as animals cannot have that high of intelligence, or would it become a magical beast. He thinks it might be similar to an int of 3 being a prerequisite to become a magic beast; thus from then on the companion simply takes levels in "magical beast" What are your thoughts on how this works or if its even possible?<br />
<br />
:I think all your questions are answered here: [[Bagheera (DnD NPC)|Bagheera]] and here: [[Talk:Bagheera (DnD NPC)|Bagheera]]. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 21:38, 17 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Aegir Stuff ==<br />
<br />
Thanks for fixing my campaign setting's pages, still new so I don't know all the conventions ''':)''' I will be sure to use "Aegir Supplement" from now on. --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 10:49, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Glad to help ''':)'''. Also, I changed the breadcrumb to have the campaign setting's identifier as well, so watch out when you are creating a new page that you add the new name. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:53, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::I will be sure to do so. I also hunted down my few remaining links and changed them to the new format. --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 11:26, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Oh, one further question - should quests set specifically in this setting have the (3.5e Quest) identifier, or the (Aegir Supplement) identifier? Currently I am just using the quest one, since I include info for adapting the quest to other settings. --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 11:27, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::The "(3.5e Quest)" identifier would be correct. And, if I remember correctly, your quest has the two breadcrumbs, the one for the Quest area and the other for the Aegir setting area, right? If so it is good. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 12:32, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Deleting ==<br />
<br />
Hi there! I've been trying to create a class and... Well, I'm doing horrible at it, all of the language stuff is making me confused x_x I can get a bulk of it, but I don't want the idea I have to simply break down into nothing, could you help me out? As well, if my work is er... How shall I say... Crumbling, how can I go about deleting it? {{Unsigned|Nevermore|15:53, 23 October 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
:I'm not completely sure what you asking... But if you want it deleted take a look at [[:Category:Candidates for deletion]], that should help answer your questions. If that is too confusing, I can help you out. What's the name of this class? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:03, 24 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== question about maps ==<br />
<br />
i wanted to know the rules formats and policies on posting maps on the site. i have a few relatively good ones and wanted to know what you had to say before i posted<br />
<br />
--[[User:Moon Sugar Vehk|Moon Sugar Vehk]] 08:52, 27 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
Moon Sugar Vehk<br />
<br />
== one more question serjo ==<br />
<br />
I wanted to know if you had an invision free board for messaging or if you wanted one. Questions would probably get answered faster ....just a suggestion<br />
<br />
--[[User:Moon Sugar Vehk|Moon Sugar Vehk]] 08:57, 27 October 2008 (MDT)</div>Moon Sugar Vehkhttps://www.dandwiki.com/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Green_Dragon&diff=289041User talk:Green Dragon2008-10-27T14:52:05Z<p>Moon Sugar Vehk: New section: question about maps</p>
<hr />
<div>{{:User:Green Dragon/Top Template}}<br />
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}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Vest_of_the_Bold_(DnD_Equipment)<br />
|section=<br />
|notifier=Cronocke<br />
|date_time=05:17, 18 February 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Pedistal_of_Truth_(DnD_Equipment)<br />
|section=Format Format<br />
|notifier=Green Dragon<br />
|date_time=09:40, 16 February 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Performer_(DnD_Prestige_Class)<br />
|section=<br />
|notifier=Cerin616<br />
|date_time=18:22, 11 February 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Main_Page<br />
|section=<br />
|notifier=Sam Kay<br />
|date_time=07:20, 5 February 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Paladin_Mount_from_first_level_(DnD_Variant_Rule)<br />
|section=<br />
|notifier=Sam Kay<br />
|date_time=09:35, 4 February 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Myrmidon_(DnD_Class)<br />
|section=all of it<br />
|notifier=Tetsurga<br />
|date_time=17:54, 31 January 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:DnD_Maps<br />
|section=Maybe this should be in environments after all?<br />
|notifier=EldritchNumen<br />
|date_time=12:32, 3 January 2008 (MST)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Talk:Chromatic_Dwarf_(DnD_Creature)<br />
|section=Race<br />
|notifier=Green Dragon<br />
|date_time=23:45, 1 June 2007 (MDT)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=Combat_School_(DnD_Variant_Rules)<br />
|section=<br />
|notifier=Green Dragon<br />
|date_time=23:57, 21 May 2007 (MDT)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=MediaWiki:Sharedupload<br />
|section=<br />
|notifier=Green Dragon<br />
|date_time=23:01, 14 May 2007 (MDT)<br />
}}<br />
{{MoI-Row<br />
|page=dndmedia:D&D_Wiki_Media_talk:Copyrights<br />
|section=Image documentation<br />
|notifier=Cuthalion<br />
|date_time=14:11, 11 May 2007 (MDT)<br />
}}<br />
}}<br />
<br />
<br />
{{Archives<br />
|label1= Archive 1 (Discussions 1 &ndash; 30)<br />
|label2= Archive 2 (Discussions 31 &ndash; 60)<br />
|label3= Archive 3 (Discussions 61 &ndash; 90)<br />
|label4= Archive 4 (Discussions 91 &ndash; 120)<br />
|label5= Archive 5 (Discussions 121 &ndash; 150)<br />
|label6= Archive 6 (Discussions 151 &ndash; 180)<br />
|label7= Archive 7 (Discussions 181 &ndash; 210)<br />
|label8= Archive 8 (Discussions 211 &ndash; 240)<br />
|label9= Archive 9 (Discussions 241 &ndash; 270)<br />
|label10= Archive 10 (Discussions 271 &ndash; 300)<br />
|label11= Archive 11 (Discussions 301 &ndash; 330)<br />
}}<br />
<br />
== Recent Changes ==<br />
<br />
Is it possible to have a recent changes for articles in a catergory? --[[User:Sabre070|Sabre070]] 09:36, 9 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Yes. See an example below:<br />
:<nowiki><dpl></nowiki><br />
:category=Race<br />
:ordermethod=firstedit<br />
:count=10<br />
:order=descending<br />
:notnamespace=Category<br />
:<nowiki></dpl></nowiki><br />
<br />
:Hope that helps! --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 10:37, 9 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Additionally you can always use <tt><nowiki>[{{SERVER}}{{localurl:Special:Recentchangeslinked/Category:______}} RC for ______]</nowiki></tt> (feel free to test it out in the [[Sandbox]]). Hope this helps as well. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 20:54, 9 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== How Do I Add a New Page To My Userpage? ==<br />
<br />
I need to know for one of my projects --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 04:30, 16 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
: You can make a link to pages using this: <nowiki>[[Page name|Show text]]</nowiki>. This will allow you to make a new page or link to a pre-existing page. You also have to options to make new pages via the "preloads", the "Add new (something)" links. Hope this helps.. :) --[[User:Sabre070|Sabre070]] 06:03, 16 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::i meant so the title would be like User:Jack Bread/(name) something like that --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 21:27, 18 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::Here's how i do it - just type what you want to name the page in the search box ("User:Jack Bread/MainPage" as an example) and then click go. It will bring up the page you type in. After that you can just edit the page and you're good to go. Hope I was helpful :) --[[User:EaTCarbS|EaTCarbS]] 03:58, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::I agree, the "Search" method is best. Additionally you can always edit the sandbox, type in your page name, then click the red link. Hope this helps as well. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:55, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::Thanks! --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 17:38, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::No problem, glad to help. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 17:39, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== 4e Powers ==<br />
<br />
There seem to be a few formatting errors on the pages for the SRD 4e Powers. I suggest taking a look at them so you can determine exactly what you need to do, but the main one I've noticed happened to be one of the lines missing the category= line. This has resulted in those pages not displaying any of the information they should. --[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 09:21, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:I am a little confused. First off no SRD 4e powers are present on D&D Wiki as the SRD has yet to be freely released for 4e. Also, <tt>category=</tt> needs to be present in dpl's as it will not work without it. This defines the parameter. If you could supply a link to the page you are curious about I would be very appreciated. Thanks. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 16:54, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::It happens to be [[4e Powers|this page]] and pages similar to [[4e_Martial_Powers|this page.]] The pages like 4e Martial Powers are supposed to be for homebrewed powers for already existing power sources, or for already existing classes, right? Well, the problem is when you view the pages, nothing appears. This is because the line that should say category=Level 1 Powers, or some other level, lacks the category= at the beginning of the line. Sorry if my original explanation confused you.--[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 17:45, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::You are completely right, they are lacking the category= in front of the categories. Feel free to fix this for all the 4e pages! Thanks in advance! --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 17:51, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::Lol, I would, but they're all protected. Forgetting not everyone is an admin?--[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 17:57, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::There we go &mdash; changed them to only be locked to IP eidts. That's how they were supposed to be all along. Sorry about that. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 18:03, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::::Oh, lord. Somebody needs to lay off the booze when they make these big pages... Categorical mistakes everywhere. There is no Power category, but there is a 4e Power category. No Arcane category but there is a 4e Arcane Power category. All over everything...--[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 18:12, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::::::I can only agree, strange mistakes and strange things like this are all over the 4e homebrew areas. ''Please'' feel free to standardize things &mdash; it truly would be a huge help. If you are really interested in helping out the 4e homebrew section [[Talk:4e Homebrew#Quality Control]] may interest you. Please feel free to help, it needs it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 18:14, 24 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Quick Question From A New Guy On Article Deletion ==<br />
<br />
Hi, I recently posted a short article on the campaign setting I made for my tabletop game (Four Worlds, was the name). I was planning on updating it every few days with more information, but today I see it was deleted. It might just be because I'm not used to the way these articles work yet, but I couldn't find any description of why it was deleted. I'm just wondering why it was and if I should write up a more substantial portion before creating it. Thanks. --[[User:Windandfire|windandfire]] 23:29, 24 July 2008 (MDT)Windandfire<br />
<br />
:I have restored [[Four Worlds (DnD Campaign Setting)]]. I deleted it because it seemed very sparse in information and I thought it was not going to be worked on. Sorry about that, and I have restored it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:58, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::That's ok. I'll be trying to add to it every weekday, so it should grow quickly. Thanks for restoring it. --[[User:Windandfire|windandfire]] 12:51, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::No problem, sorry about deleting it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 17:32, 25 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Tavern Spammer ==<br />
<br />
IP # I69_119_7_80 was spamming in the tavern and being outright annoying, I cant do anything, so i figured I'd let you know, if anything can be done, that would be great, thank you, [[User:Summerscythe|Summerscythe]] 13:59, 26 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Currently banning individuals from editing does nothing to their tavern usage... I'm terribly sorry about this. I have asked [[User:Blue Dragon|Blue Dragon]] to change this numerous times, he just has not got around to fixing this problem yet. Is this still a problem? If so i'll talk to him more forcibly about this problem ''';)'''. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:23, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== THE ULTIMATE BAG OF BEANS!! '''>:D''' ==<br />
<br />
I wanted to know if I could put an 2nd edition magic item on the site and convert it to 3.5. --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 15:05, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:If you made the item, feel free. If it was published it is okay if it's OGC. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:20, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::It was homebrew, made by someone else, I can give you a link if you like --[[User:Jack Bread|Jack Bread]] 15:32, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::As long as you have their permission, please feel free to add it! --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 15:33, 30 July 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Paragon Class Preload ==<br />
<br />
Would you mind changing the Paragon Class preload to use the [[template:4e Paragon Class Power]] instead of the tables that is currently does? And don't you dare tell me I should make it into a form.--[[User:Taritus|Taritus]] 22:44, 2 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Soulbinder ==<br />
<br />
I believe the soulbinder finally meets the standards for featured article, if you want to look it over and tell me what you think that would be great. thanks[[User:Summerscythe|Summerscythe]] 11:10, 6 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
P.S. I dont want to sound pushy, I'm just really excited.<br />
<br />
== Lock Up Please ==<br />
<br />
[[Bag of Numerous Items (DnD Equipment)]] I would like it if you locked up this I don't want anyone messing with it (the sooner the better). {{Unsigned|Necrorock|05:09, 9 August 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
:I locked it. Let me know if you want me to unlock it. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 12:54, 9 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== THANKS ==<br />
<br />
i think it was you who locked up my page so thanks even it it wasnt the page was bag of numerous items by necrorock<br />
<br />
== My Mask of It. ==<br />
<br />
I was wondering, do I have the price made correctly? If not, feel free to change it. Also, you rule for making this site. The URL of it is: http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Mask_of_IT_%28DnD_Equipment%29. And if there is anything else wrong, feel free to edit.<br />
<br />
== Problem with ritual ==<br />
<br />
Hi, in my ritual Raise (Create) Undead, i can't add the time and duration of it, don't know why?--[[User:dokuro|dokuro]]<br />
<br />
== Thanks for the greeting ==<br />
<br />
Thank's for the greeting, I apreciate it. I was kinda wondering the best way besides going into the tavern (witch i love) to get my prestige class rated or to get some kind of review of it... it is my first one and I am not sure how balanced it is as a class. Anyways Thanks again.<br />
--[[User:Fletcher123|Fletcher123]] 15:43, 20 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Tavern Moderators ==<br />
<br />
We really need some moderators in the Tavern, because every once in a while we get people in there who just spam and make it nearly impossible to chat. Today a little before 8:00 PM EST was a good example. Perhaps wiki admins could be turned into chat moderators as well, or perhaps have it be a separate status requiring a separate vote, or...something. Whatever the method, we need mods. --[[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]] 18:03, 20 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Double plus agreement. We have several regulars. Having one who can use that Kick function in chat would be just dandy. I might even refrain from partaking in your delicious flesh, Burger Dragon. I mean Green. Yes.<br />
:But yes, seriously, I fully support this request. -- [[User:Eiji|Eiji]] 14:42, 22 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Bump. For the love of god, please give at least one regular to the tavern mod powers. --[[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]] 18:10, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::I would vote [[User:Ganteka|Ganteka]], [[User:Daniel Draco|Daniel Draco]], and [[User:Eiji|Eiji]] at least since I see them in there a lot (and they are all mature enough not to abuse powers). --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 21:32, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== 3.x Conversions ==<br />
<br />
I have converted a few 3.x Monsters, that were not presented in the new MM, into 4e versions. Is it alright to post them on the Wiki? -- [[User:Sepsis|Sepsis]] 22:16, 26 August 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== petition to remove content ==<br />
<br />
hello :)<br />
<br />
i believe that my paragon class for the wizard is no good and would like it for you to take it off please! :)<br />
<br />
the reason for this is that i think that the aim of the paragon tier is not for such a big change on the base class.[[User:Dokuro|Dokuro]]<br />
<br />
== A Few Questions ==<br />
<br />
So this is Mander. About a year ago I got really involved with the wiki, and have since been less involved. I'm looking to be more involved again. I was wondering, is there a forum like section on this webpage where I could start a topic or two for discussion? Also I have more to add to this wiki, but I seem to be starting over on my wiki skills. In a sense I'm looking for a wiki mentor. I'm sure I had other questions, I'm just forgetting them right now. {{Unsigned|Mander|14:58, 6 September 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
:Hello Mander! Welcome back. If you have some questions feel free to ask them on [[DnD Discussion|Discussions]]. Also, I would be more than willing to take a look at your creations, and help you format them, once you have added them. Just give me a link once the page is created and I will see what can be improved. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 11:05, 30 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== My Additions ==<br />
<br />
I don't suppose you could check over the [[Elementalist (DnD Prestige Class)|Elementalist]] prestige class, and [[Arcane Leadership (DnD Feat)|Arcane Leadership]], [[Ascetic Leadership (DnD Feat)|Ascetic Leadership]], [[Divine Leadership (DnD Feat)|Divine Leadership]], [[Martial Leadership (DnD Feat)|Martial Leadership]] and [[Wild Leadership (DnD Feat)|Wild Leadership]] feats? The leadership feats were inspired by Undead Leadership from Libris Mortis, so they follow the same basic idea - is that okay OGL-wise? --[[User:Damuna|Damuna]] 19:18, 6 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:If you want to do the need changes yourself for practice, the feats need to have links put in them. --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 12:28, 7 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Namespace addition ==<br />
<br />
Hi Green_Dragon!<br />
<br />
I am currently in the process of splitting material like prestige classes out of four very long articles ([[Tome of Necromancy (DnD Other)]], [[Tome of Fiends (DnD Other)]], [[Dungeonomicon (DnD Other)]], [[Races of War (DnD Other)]]) into their own articles, for easier digestion and use/reference by people. Unfortunately, while doing so, I've run into a couple of namespace conflicts. I'm worried about more namespace conflicts and namespace pollution in the future; so I was wondering if instead of, say, (DnD Prestige Class) appended onto prestige classes, I could use something like (Tome Prestige Class) as people often call those four works "The Tomes".<br />
<br />
I am given to understand that there are scripts that automagically add prestige classes to the list of homebrew prestige classes when new prestige classes are made. I am also given to understand that this only works with the (DnD Prestige Class) namespace. Is my understanding correct? If I can use the new namespace, is it okay for me to edit those articles by hand to add the prestige classes in at the correct points? (Or could the scripts be extended to the Tome namespace, if such is allowed?)<br />
<br />
Thanks! [[User:Surgo|Surgo]] 18:36, 8 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Epic-only PrC Templates ==<br />
<br />
I noticed recently that there aren't preloads or categories for prestige classes with epic level requirements, as I'm have little skill at making them, I wondered if you might do the honors? Here's one that can be added: [[Thlatian Bladelord (DnD Prestige Class)]]. Thanks!-[[User:Risek|Risek]] 11:15, 10 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Modern's Future? ==<br />
<br />
I hope you are right one to ask, since the d20 Modern fellow is away.<br />
<br />
Well I have a rather serious question concerning d20 Modern and well…err let me get to the point.<br />
<br />
Since d20 Modern is out of print and majority of the material is hard to come by shouldn’t the rest of the material be placed in the Modern section. The reason for concern is that there’s is a good chance that Hasbro will try to completely kill-off Modern and well since I love Modern I was simply wondering whether the remaining material will be added or not.<br />
<br />
I mean, from what I can tell 2nd Edition players generally have the complete material for use online and so I thought that Modern should as well.<br />
<br />
Gah! hope I said what I meant to say.<br />
<br />
-Magus Black, the Oracle of Blades<br />
<br />
== Who do I ask to review a custom class I created? ==<br />
<br />
As the title states:<br />
Who do I ask to review a custom class I created?<br />
<br />
:Best bet is to put a link with the question and someone may take a look. Which class is it? --[[User:Calidore Chase|Calidore Chase]] 13:30, 3 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Foxphyre Page IP Lock ==<br />
<br />
I would like my page locked to IPs, and if possible set properly to have me as its creator, because I didn't register till a while after its creation. link follows [[Foxphyre (DnD Race)]]. {{Unsigned|Morbosa|17:01, 24 September 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
<br />
:Done. Let me know if that's what you had in mind. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:56, 30 September 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== A question about the scout's skirmish ability ==<br />
<br />
Hey it said if I had any question about d&d or anything to ask, well my current question is about the Scout's (3.5e Complete Adventurer) skirmish ability. In the ability description it says the scout gets to apply skirmish damage if they move at least 10 ft. Well me and my friends were wondering how this worked when the scout is mounted. Does the actually scout have to move 10 ft, or do they get skirmish damage if their mount moves 10 at least ft? Also if only the mount has to move, if only the mount has to move then this enables the scout to do a full attack with skirmish and our second question is would the scout get skirmish damage from ever attack?<br />
<br />
What are your thoughts on this?<br />
<br />
:I can answer these. Skirmish does not work with mounts (being displaced 10 ft. is different than physically moving 10 ft). You can get full attack + skirmish with a variety of tricks such as the Pounce ability (look at the complete champion barbarian variant), or the [[SRD:Psychic Warrior|Psychic Warrior]]'s ''[[SRD:Psionic Lion's Charge|Psionic Lion's Charge]]'' power. Skirmish applies to every attack much like sneak attack does. Take a look at the Improved Skirmish feat (also Complete adventurer I think) as well as Swift Ambusher (Complete Scoundrel). Improved Skirmish will add +2d6 damage if you move 20ft. Swift ambusher stacks ranger levels with scout levels for the purposes of skirmish. You can use this to have a high Base Attack Bonus and high skirmish (though the barbarian level will add an exp penalty unless you make the build very carefully).<br />
<br />
:Above all optimization, have fun playing a scout! They offer a lot of fun tactical decisions and they don't need to be optimized to do cool things. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 13:47, 6 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Featured Article ==<br />
<br />
I've been a member of this site for around 6 months, and for about 5 of those months, cassia has been the featured article. Now i have nothing against the article, cuz its a good article, but its been up for a long time, and there are about ten other candidates in line, all great articles. i believe a change should happen pretty soon. Your Friend, [[User:Summerscythe|Summerscythe]] 12:57, 6 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:I completely agree. The only issue is that the current FA Nominees may or may not meet the FA criteria. If you have some spare time please help format and/or review some of the FA Nominees so we can bring them up to the FA criteria. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 09:28, 7 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
==Epic home brew==<br />
So, I realize my combat Assassin is a little overpowered for a prestige class. Mainly just because i never meant for it to be prestige, but as an epic addition. Is there a way to have an Epic prestige area for home brew content? thanks --[[User:Cerin616|Cerin616, Drew]] 18:54, 6 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Quest/Campaign and Subpages ==<br />
<br />
Hey Green Dragon!<br />
<br />
Thanks for the welcome message.<br />
<br />
I am working on [[Soul of the Dragon Seer (3.5e Quest)|Soul of the Dragon Seer]] and I have a few questions. First, this is going to be a campaign, rather than one stand-alone quest. I therefore am trying to figure out how to organize it, since I don't see any pages like that in the quest section. Should it instead go in the "Campaign World" section? Should the adventures that make up this campaign go in subpages, or have their own pages? Should NPCs and items be in subpages?<br />
<br />
I am also curious if this sort of article is even something you want on the wiki. It is more extensive than a stand-alone quest, so I am not sure if another DM would be as likely to use it.<br />
<br />
Thanks for the help/advice! --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 16:20, 7 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:Adding it as a Campaign Setting would be the correct method. Each area of the Campaign world should have it's own page. A good example of how a CS should be organized can be found on any of the CS's which are rated 5. Hope this helps. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 11:28, 8 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::Eh, I'm still confused, because it sounds like you are talking about an article for the world itself, which I also plan to make. What I am talking about is a series of quests that make up an overall "campaign". Does that still go in the "Campaign ''Setting''" section, even though its not really a setting? Thanks again for the advice :) -[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 12:38, 8 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
:::I think Endhaven has something similar to what you are looking for. See: [[Adventures (Endhaven)]]. There isn't anything there yet, but that is the way I would organize things. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 12:11, 9 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
::::Ah, that makes sense. I'm wondering if there would still be a way to link it from the quest page, though, since folks could potentially set the adventure in some other setting. But from what I understand, the article has to have (3.5e Quest) in the title to show up on that page. Hmmm... --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 12:58, 9 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
::::EDIT: On closer examination, it looks like its based on categories. That is really neat. I'll try some reorganizing then. --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 13:03, 9 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Gmandark. sorry ==<br />
<br />
hi thanks for the wellcume. I tride to ad a new warlock ivocasho to the list i fond but i mest it up all tho i am shore i will be abal to fix it in time i wood be very happy if sume one cude fix it in the meen time as im nuw to this and need to lern more about (a)wot i did rong and (b)how to fix it and this mite tack a fow weeks or munths<br />
<br />
== Another Question ==<br />
<br />
Hey thanks for answering my question about Skirmish, now one of my players has another question....<br />
It says that an animal cannot have an intelligence of above 2, in fact the exact wording is "a creature with an intelligence greater than 2, is not an animal." And it says that magical beasts are like animals except that they can have an intelligence of 3 or higher. The question he poses, is what would happen if when his dire hawk animal companion gained 4 or 8 hit dice, if he could increase its Int to 3. Is this possible as animals cannot have that high of intelligence, or would it become a magical beast. He thinks it might be similar to an int of 3 being a prerequisite to become a magic beast; thus from then on the companion simply takes levels in "magical beast" What are your thoughts on how this works or if its even possible?<br />
<br />
:I think all your questions are answered here: [[Bagheera (DnD NPC)|Bagheera]] and here: [[Talk:Bagheera (DnD NPC)|Bagheera]]. --[[User:Aarnott|Aarnott]] 21:38, 17 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
<br />
== Aegir Stuff ==<br />
<br />
Thanks for fixing my campaign setting's pages, still new so I don't know all the conventions ''':)''' I will be sure to use "Aegir Supplement" from now on. --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 10:49, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
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:Glad to help ''':)'''. Also, I changed the breadcrumb to have the campaign setting's identifier as well, so watch out when you are creating a new page that you add the new name. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:53, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
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::I will be sure to do so. I also hunted down my few remaining links and changed them to the new format. --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 11:26, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
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:::Oh, one further question - should quests set specifically in this setting have the (3.5e Quest) identifier, or the (Aegir Supplement) identifier? Currently I am just using the quest one, since I include info for adapting the quest to other settings. --[[User:Jiyambi|Jiyambi]] 11:27, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
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::::The "(3.5e Quest)" identifier would be correct. And, if I remember correctly, your quest has the two breadcrumbs, the one for the Quest area and the other for the Aegir setting area, right? If so it is good. --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 12:32, 20 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
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== Deleting ==<br />
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Hi there! I've been trying to create a class and... Well, I'm doing horrible at it, all of the language stuff is making me confused x_x I can get a bulk of it, but I don't want the idea I have to simply break down into nothing, could you help me out? As well, if my work is er... How shall I say... Crumbling, how can I go about deleting it? {{Unsigned|Nevermore|15:53, 23 October 2008 (MDT)}}<br />
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:I'm not completely sure what you asking... But if you want it deleted take a look at [[:Category:Candidates for deletion]], that should help answer your questions. If that is too confusing, I can help you out. What's the name of this class? --[[User:Green Dragon|Green Dragon]] 10:03, 24 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
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== question about maps ==<br />
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i wanted to know the rules formats and policies on posting maps on the site. i have a few relatively good ones and wanted to know what you had to say before i posted<br />
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--[[User:Moon Sugar Vehk|Moon Sugar Vehk]] 08:52, 27 October 2008 (MDT)<br />
Moon Sugar Vehk</div>Moon Sugar Vehkhttps://www.dandwiki.com/w/index.php?title=User:Moon_Sugar_Vehk&diff=288388User:Moon Sugar Vehk2008-10-24T17:39:09Z<p>Moon Sugar Vehk: New page: If anyone has anything to say about my posts you can email me at Moonsugarvehk@yahoo.com il start checking it if i start getting some good questions and responses</p>
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<div>If anyone has anything to say about my posts you can email me at Moonsugarvehk@yahoo.com il start checking it if i start getting some good questions and responses</div>Moon Sugar Vehk